Redeveloping Pittodrie - Options

[The Boofon]

4 minutes ago, JojoJuan said:

I would be happy with just rebuilding stand by stand over a period of time, but I suspect with new building regs and HSE requirements we might really struggle to get the same capacity in the same footprint with a rebuilt stand. Not really much room to expand the structure in any direction other than the RDS which doesn't really need expanding 

Nonsense.

 

This has been covered here multiple times. It's perfectly feasible and not out with any sort of building or other regulations.

[RDS]

15 minutes ago, The Boofon said:

Nonsense.

 

This has been covered here multiple times. It's perfectly feasible and not out with any sort of building or other regulations.

Although you claim feasible are there not current Uefa regulations we'd need to meet like making pitch wider and longer, evacuation areas and other factors like press areas that would reduce capacity on current footprint

[huncunts]

33 minutes ago, JojoJuan said:

I would be happy with just rebuilding stand by stand over a period of time, but I suspect with new building regs and HSE requirements we might really struggle to get the same capacity in the same footprint with a rebuilt stand. Not really much room to expand the structure in any direction other than the RDS which doesn't really need expanding 

Let's explain it again and hopefully it's the last time anyone suggests redeveloping Pittodrie. 

Rows need to be deeper and seats need to be wider. Stairs need to be within 10 seats when they're over that in all 3 dilapidated stands. There has to be a certain number of toilets and exits.

The concourse needs to be able to hold the capacity of the stand and they're clearly nowhere near that. The answer to that is having the concourse under the stand like at Hibs for example. We can't build the stands taller due to the residential buildings behind them who would object to living in darkness so it's a non-starter. On top of that there needs to be access for emergency service vehicles around the stadium which would further reduce the footprint of the South.

The capacity of the Main would be chopped down to almost nothing in order to meet the Uefa requirements for the amount and size of facilities required within it such as rooms for officials and broadcasting and seating for media and VIPs.

The pitch is currently 5 metres short and 2 metres thin and there's supposed to be a minimum run-off of around 5 metres if I remember correctly, when there's currently around 2 metres on the sidelines.

The club haven't been lying all this time. Redeveloping Pittodrie would reduce the capacity to a pointlessly low amount, ever since they allowed us to be hemmed in by residential buildings and the guidelines for stadium building have reached the point they're at now.

[The Boofon]

5 minutes ago, huncunts said:

Let's explain it again and hopefully it's the last time anyone suggests redeveloping Pittodrie. 

Rows need to be deeper and seats need to be wider. Stairs need to be within 10 seats when they're over that in all 3 dilapidated stands. There has to be a certain number of toilets and exits.

The concourse needs to be able to hold the capacity of the stand and they're clearly nowhere near that. The answer to that is having the concourse under the stand like at Hibs for example. We can't build the stands taller due to the residential buildings behind them who would object to living in darkness so it's a non-starter. On top of that there needs to be access for emergency service vehicles around the stadium which would further reduce the footprint of the South.

The capacity of the Main would be chopped down to almost nothing in order to meet the Uefa requirements for the amount and size of facilities required within it such as rooms for officials and broadcasting and seating for media and VIPs.

The pitch is currently 5 metres short and 2 metres thin and there's supposed to be a minimum run-off of around 5 metres if I remember correctly, when there's currently around 2 metres on the sidelines.

The club haven't been lying all this time. Redeveloping Pittodrie would reduce the capacity to a pointlessly low amount, ever since they allowed us to be hemmed in by residential buildings and the guidelines for stadium building have reached the point they're at now.

NRT

[JojoJuan]

3 minutes ago, huncunts said:

Let's explain it again and hopefully it's the last time anyone suggests redeveloping Pittodrie. 

Rows need to be deeper and seats need to be wider. Stairs need to be within 10 seats when they're over that in all 3 dilapidated stands. There has to be a certain number of toilets and exits.

The concourse needs to be able to hold the capacity of the stand and they're clearly nowhere near that. The answer to that is having the concourse under the stand like at Hibs for example. We can't build the stands taller due to the residential buildings behind them who would object to living in darkness so it's a non-starter. On top of that there needs to be access for emergency service vehicles around the stadium which would further reduce the footprint of the South.

The capacity of the Main would be chopped down to almost nothing in order to meet the Uefa requirements for the amount and size of facilities required within it such as rooms for officials and broadcasting and seating for media and VIPs.

The pitch is currently 5 metres short and 2 metres thin and there's supposed to be a minimum run-off of around 5 metres if I remember correctly, when there's currently around 2 metres on the sidelines.

The club haven't been lying all this time. Redeveloping Pittodrie would reduce the capacity to a pointlessly low amount, ever since they allowed us to be hemmed in by residential buildings and the guidelines for stadium building have reached the point they're at now.

I don't think we are disagreeing here. 

I am saying that I personally would be happy to see us rebuild stand by stand, but for the reasons you mention and others it would be difficult to maintain capacity, which I wouldn't want to see reduced.

What we can do is improve the maintenance of what we do have, given that we are unlikely to be moving anywhere else anytime soon

[sooth_stander]

So, if short to medium term probably means something like 5 to 10 years, shouldn’t we look at installing safe standing, rail type terracing in the RedShed? I know the concrete foundations aren’t deep enough to take the rods that support the railings (doesn’t it have to be something like 600mm deep?) but surely, next summer, the Ultras section in the middle of the Merkie could be dug out and reconstructed, in order to be compliant for safe standing, meaning we could get more people in there?

[JojoJuan]

39 minutes ago, The Boofon said:

Nonsense.

 

This has been covered here multiple times. It's perfectly feasible and not out with any sort of building or other regulations.

It would be great if this were the case. I haven't been part of many discussions around this for Pittodrie in particular, and I am curious how you see it working. 

The reason I suspect it will be difficult is that any building we have looked at replacing through my work, there are so many more rules, meaning that we can never replace something like for like. We always lose space to things like wider access and stairways, emergency service provision etc. 

Most public buildings would no longer be allowed to be built with their current layouts.

If there is a solution to that on the same footprint then great, I would love to see how it would work without loss of capacity.

(Genuinely interested, not looking for an argument on it)

[huncunts]

10 minutes ago, JojoJuan said:

I don't think we are disagreeing here. 

I am saying that I personally would be happy to see us rebuild stand by stand, but for the reasons you mention and others it would be difficult to maintain capacity, which I wouldn't want to see reduced.

What we can do is improve the maintenance of what we do have, given that we are unlikely to be moving anywhere else anytime soon

I was just expanding your point for the people still suggesting it. It's not possible, give it up.

This stadium fiasco is a black mark against Cormack. He's actually taken us backwards since 2018. Burrows doesn't seem to have any interest in advancing the cause either.

If they said to the council you pay for a brand spanking new stadium for the city, we'll pay rent of say £2m a year and take all matchday earnings while you keep the earnings outside matchdays, it would make perfect sense to me, but I've not heard any proposal like that.

[sooth_stander]

1 hour ago, huncunts said:

I was just expanding your point for the people still suggesting it. It's not possible, give it up.

This stadium fiasco is a black mark against Cormack. He's actually taken us backwards since 2018. Burrows doesn't seem to have any interest in advancing the cause either.

If they said to the council you pay for a brand spanking new stadium for the city, we'll pay rent of say £2m a year and take all matchday earnings while you keep the earnings outside matchdays, it would make perfect sense to me, but I've not heard any proposal like that.

Burrows has gone very quiet recently. Alleged £164k salary and he works from home in Lanarkshire, mainly.

[shut up meg]

14 minutes ago, sooth_stander said:

Burrows has gone very quiet recently. Alleged £164k salary and he works from home in Lanarkshire, mainly.

Working towards net zero

[Dynamo]

The South Stand gets a hard time. I think it's brilliant. New seats and bring back the bath and we're sorted. 

 

[huncunts]

25 minutes ago, sooth_stander said:

Burrows has gone very quiet recently. Alleged £164k salary and he works from home in Lanarkshire, mainly.

Finance director was on a bit more than that I'm sure I read.

Time for him to come up with a proposal for the council to pay for it and us to rent it.

[RDS]

1 hour ago, huncunts said:

 

If they said to the council you pay for a brand spanking new stadium for the city, we'll pay rent of say £2m a year and take all matchday earnings while you keep the earnings outside matchdays, it would make perfect sense to me, but I've not heard any proposal like that.

Likely not heard any proposal like that as Council can't afford to build it regardless of what club offers and whilst it makes perfect sense to you I doubt it does to club or council

[huncunts]

7 minutes ago, RDS said:

Likely not heard any proposal like that as Council can't afford to build it regardless of what club offers and whilst it makes perfect sense to you I doubt it does to club or council

They're spending £50m reconfiguring the beach boulevard for essentially no return.

£50m from them on the new Market.

£333m went on the P&J Live to host Bongo's Bingo, Offshore Europe and the darts.

Doesn't make sense to me to pay for all those potential white elephants and not something with a guaranteed return for the council in many ways.

[Dynamo]

1 hour ago, sooth_stander said:

Burrows has gone very quiet recently. Alleged £164k salary and he works from home in Lanarkshire, mainly.

Just had a baby and just because he’s not tweeting doesn’t mean he’s not doing his job 😂

[aberdeen1970]

3 minutes ago, Dynamo said:

Just had a baby and just because he’s not tweeting doesn’t mean he’s not doing his job 😂

Needs to post a December pie of the month social to get back in favour 

[sooth_stander]

50 minutes ago, Dynamo said:

Just had a baby and just because he’s not tweeting doesn’t mean he’s not doing his job 😂

That’s a belter of a paternity leave he’s just had; most of us just get the 2 weeks

[sigh]

1 hour ago, Dynamo said:

The South Stand gets a hard time. I think it's brilliant. New seats and bring back the bath and we're sorted. 

 

Bring back the bench seating, will up capacity as well

[zeroisgod76]

4 hours ago, huncunts said:

Let's explain it again and hopefully it's the last time anyone suggests redeveloping Pittodrie. 

Rows need to be deeper and seats need to be wider. Stairs need to be within 10 seats when they're over that in all 3 dilapidated stands. There has to be a certain number of toilets and exits.

The concourse needs to be able to hold the capacity of the stand and they're clearly nowhere near that. The answer to that is having the concourse under the stand like at Hibs for example. We can't build the stands taller due to the residential buildings behind them who would object to living in darkness so it's a non-starter. On top of that there needs to be access for emergency service vehicles around the stadium which would further reduce the footprint of the South.

The capacity of the Main would be chopped down to almost nothing in order to meet the Uefa requirements for the amount and size of facilities required within it such as rooms for officials and broadcasting and seating for media and VIPs.

The pitch is currently 5 metres short and 2 metres thin and there's supposed to be a minimum run-off of around 5 metres if I remember correctly, when there's currently around 2 metres on the sidelines.

The club haven't been lying all this time. Redeveloping Pittodrie would reduce the capacity to a pointlessly low amount, ever since they allowed us to be hemmed in by residential buildings and the guidelines for stadium building have reached the point they're at now.

Can explain it as many times as you like but the same people will be back on here in the future telling us all why there's no reason it can't be done. Like talking to a brick wall at times.

[fine-n-dandy]

11 minutes ago, zeroisgod76 said:

Can explain it as many times as you like but the same people will be back on here in the future telling us all why there's no reason it can't be done. Like talking to a brick wall at times.

Only reason it can’t be done is because they aren’t thinking ‘outside’ the box

[huncunts]

19 minutes ago, zeroisgod76 said:

Can explain it as many times as you like but the same people will be back on here in the future telling us all why there's no reason it can't be done. Like talking to a brick wall at times.

'Do it one stand at a time, there's got to be something that can be done'.

[Dandyesque]

Now that we've reduced the number of away fans coming to games (and we could reduce it further) we could get rid of a lot of the car park behind the South Stand and either turn the pitch or stick all the media pish in there. Would also allow us to widen the pitch and make a much bigger South stand - and then any loss of capacity from the other stands could be roughly offset.

Sorted.

[Tord31]

6 hours ago, sooth_stander said:

Burrows has gone very quiet recently. Alleged £164k salary and he works from home in Lanarkshire, mainly.

nae allegedly about either point there

[Tord31]

Build it on the cricket pitch instead. Pittodrie as a massive car park and fanzone

[Helmet]

7 hours ago, huncunts said:

I was just expanding your point for the people still suggesting it. It's not possible, give it up.

This stadium fiasco is a black mark against Cormack. He's actually taken us backwards since 2018. Burrows doesn't seem to have any interest in advancing the cause either.

If they said to the council you pay for a brand spanking new stadium for the city, we'll pay rent of say £2m a year and take all matchday earnings while you keep the earnings outside matchdays, it would make perfect sense to me, but I've not heard any proposal like that.

Why pay the council to rent anything? For £2m a year we could probably service a loan to cover the construction project and meanwhile keep all of these revenue.

The council should be facilitating the availability of some suitable land and cooperating over planning and collaborating on a plan that works well for the club and the city. That’s all.

- they shouldn’t pay for a stadium and we shouldn’t give them any money we make from one.

[pocrawred]

8 hours ago, huncunts said:

Let's explain it again and hopefully it's the last time anyone suggests redeveloping Pittodrie. 

Rows need to be deeper and seats need to be wider. Stairs need to be within 10 seats when they're over that in all 3 dilapidated stands. There has to be a certain number of toilets and exits.

The concourse needs to be able to hold the capacity of the stand and they're clearly nowhere near that. The answer to that is having the concourse under the stand like at Hibs for example. We can't build the stands taller due to the residential buildings behind them who would object to living in darkness so it's a non-starter. On top of that there needs to be access for emergency service vehicles around the stadium which would further reduce the footprint of the South.

The capacity of the Main would be chopped down to almost nothing in order to meet the Uefa requirements for the amount and size of facilities required within it such as rooms for officials and broadcasting and seating for media and VIPs.

No thats not a requirement for households. Build the South Stand higher I say.  

[huncunts]

31 minutes ago, Helmet said:

Why pay the council to rent anything? For £2m a year we could probably service a loan to cover the construction project and meanwhile keep all of these revenue.

The council should be facilitating the availability of some suitable land and cooperating over planning and collaborating on a plan that works well for the club and the city. That’s all.

- they shouldn’t pay for a stadium and we shouldn’t give them any money we make from one.

As far as I can gather they've effectively said here you go, build your stadium there but we're not giving you a penny towards it. While Cormack wants them to pay tens of millions towards it because it'll be good for the city.

If you think we can finance it ourselves then it makes even less sense why they're doing nothing.

[Helmet]

47 minutes ago, huncunts said:

As far as I can gather they've effectively said here you go, build your stadium there but we're not giving you a penny towards it. While Cormack wants them to pay tens of millions towards it because it'll be good for the city.

If you think we can finance it ourselves then it makes even less sense why they're doing nothing.

I’m not saying we can finance it-  the point is if we can afford to pay £2m a year to the council we can afford to pay £2m a year to a bank or some other investor and actually own the thing.

I don’t think we should expect the council to pay towards it, much as that would make financial sense in many way we know they won’t eve do that and it’s just not what happens in Scotland or the wider UK.

I don’t follow this shit closely so genuine question have the council actually offered land for free and guaranteed they will support the club getting planning and removing all obstacles that they might otherwise put in our way? So it’s purely a question of money?

[huncunts]

41 minutes ago, Helmet said:

I’m not saying we can finance it-  the point is if we can afford to pay £2m a year to the council we can afford to pay £2m a year to a bank or some other investor and actually own the thing.

I don’t think we should expect the council to pay towards it, much as that would make financial sense in many way we know they won’t eve do that and it’s just not what happens in Scotland or the wider UK.

I don’t follow this shit closely so genuine question have the council actually offered land for free and guaranteed they will support the club getting planning and removing all obstacles that they might otherwise put in our way? So it’s purely a question of money?

There's been no mention ever of the club having to pay for the land. Just the council repeatedly saying the club would have to pay for the whole thing if they want it to happen.

https://www.pressandjournal.co.uk/fp/news/aberdeen-aberdeenshire/6559003/dons-stadium-aberdeen-beach/

“To deliver the stadium, it would require private investment.

“It was certainly never the plan for the council to spend hundreds of millions of pounds on this and build a football stadium for Aberdeen FC

“But we are open to exploring options and there is obviously an opportunity there for the football club to collaborate with us and invest in the wider scheme.”

“I think that [the Dons stadium] is still on the table, and if the club were willing to come forward with private money for it then we could look at that.”

[Helmet]

27 minutes ago, huncunts said:

There's been no mention ever of the club having to pay for the land. Just the council repeatedly saying the club would have to pay for the whole thing if they want it to happen.

https://www.pressandjournal.co.uk/fp/news/aberdeen-aberdeenshire/6559003/dons-stadium-aberdeen-beach/

“To deliver the stadium, it would require private investment.

“It was certainly never the plan for the council to spend hundreds of millions of pounds on this and build a football stadium for Aberdeen FC

“But we are open to exploring options and there is obviously an opportunity there for the football club to collaborate with us and invest in the wider scheme.”

“I think that [the Dons stadium] is still on the table, and if the club were willing to come forward with private money for it then we could look at that.”

There you go then, they’re really offering fuck all other than to “look at” it if we find £90m down the back of the sofa- that’s hardly doing us a favour, they’d grab that sort of investment from anyone with both hands.