Jack_Glass Posted October 20, 2011 Share Posted October 20, 2011 I posted this in the heavy metal thread as well, but it deserves to be out in the open. Can anyone think of anything positive from this load of shit? Many of the reviews have been terrible, most metal fans can't believe how bad it is and I'm stunned it's even been allowed on to the market. Metallica's been a band in decline for many years, but this is beyond a joke. http://www.loureedmetallica.com/listen-to-lulu.php Link to comment
CrazyBullSheep Posted October 20, 2011 Share Posted October 20, 2011 I posted this in the heavy metal thread as well, but it deserves to be out in the open. Can anyone think of anything positive from this load of shit? Many of the reviews have been terrible, most metal fans can't believe how bad it is and I'm stunned it's even been allowed on to the market. Metallica's been a band in decline for many years, but this is beyond a joke. http://www.loureedmetallica.com/listen-to-lulu.php They would have been better off collaborating with the tweenies At least that might have been fun Link to comment
OddJob Posted October 20, 2011 Share Posted October 20, 2011 Bizzare collaboration like Link to comment
DD1903 Posted October 20, 2011 Share Posted October 20, 2011 What a racket. I never got it with Lou Reed to be honest, and this just confirms it for me. Link to comment
Chrisyboy81 Posted October 20, 2011 Share Posted October 20, 2011 Separately I'm a fan but together I can't see it. Admittedly I've not heard anything from them, but I can imagine and that's enough. Having said that many didn't believe s and m would work... Link to comment
CrazyBullSheep Posted October 20, 2011 Share Posted October 20, 2011 Dont know who wrote the lyrics but the opening I could cut your tits off Blah blah blah sounds like a converstaion I once had with Cheesepipes Link to comment
tommo1903 Posted October 20, 2011 Share Posted October 20, 2011 Death Magnetic is good. Best since ...Justice. But yeah, that album is awful. Link to comment
Jack_Glass Posted October 21, 2011 Author Share Posted October 21, 2011 Death Magnetic is good. Best since ...Justice. But yeah, that album is awful. I'll give you that, but the production on both St Anger & Death Magnetic is a bit dodgy to say the least. The snare drum sound on DM is badly recorded and the amount of crap production & musicianship on St Anger does not even merit discussion. Personally I'd say Megadeth have caught up and bettered Metallica in terms of musicianship & production, especially on their last 2 or 3 albums including the new one. In fact from what I've heard so far the new Megadeth album sounds incredible. Link to comment
tommo1903 Posted October 21, 2011 Share Posted October 21, 2011 I'll give you that, but the production on both St Anger & Death Magnetic is a bit dodgy to say the least. The snare drum sound on DM is badly recorded and the amount of crap production & musicianship on St Anger does not even merit discussion. Personally I'd say Megadeth have caught up and bettered Metallica in terms of musicianship & production, especially on their last 2 or 3 albums including the new one. In fact from what I've heard so far the new Megadeth album sounds incredible. Yeah. have you heard the re-mastered DM? Actually, live the DM songs sound incredible. St Anger gets a bad reputation, the production on it turned it from being an ok album to shite. Again, the songs sound pretty decent live (Frantic especially). Megadeth have been far more consistent, but I dont think that any of their albums are better than Metallicas first 4 albums. Metallica are also phenomenal live, better than 'Deth (Having said that, Medadeth played one of the best festival performances I've ever seen at Download 2005). The only album of the other members of the "Big 4" that gets close to the first 4 'tallica albums is Among The Living. F*ckin love Anthrax. Link to comment
Chrisyboy81 Posted October 21, 2011 Share Posted October 21, 2011 Yeah. have you heard the re-mastered DM? Actually, live the DM songs sound incredible. St Anger gets a bad reputation, the production on it turned it from being an ok album to shite. Again, the songs sound pretty decent live (Frantic especially). Megadeth have been far more consistent, but I dont think that any of their albums are better than Metallicas first 4 albums. Metallica are also phenomenal live, better than 'Deth (Having said that, Medadeth played one of the best festival performances I've ever seen at Download 2005). The only album of the other members of the "Big 4" that gets close to the first 4 'tallica albums is Among The Living. F*ckin love Anthrax.I can't bear St Anger I really think it's terrible. The only thing on it I can listen to the whole way through is the title track, the rest I really don't like. I quite like DM, but the production is odd. They seem to have a thing about dodgy production, the missing bass on "Justice" for example. I still think they are immense though, it's just a pity they aren't releasing a shit-hot follow up to DM instead of this spoken word pish. Link to comment
tommo1903 Posted October 21, 2011 Share Posted October 21, 2011 They seem to have a thing about dodgy production, the missing bass on "Justice" for example. That not down to the fact that Jason Newsted had just joined, and they basically bullied him his whole tenure? Haha. Link to comment
Jack_Glass Posted October 21, 2011 Author Share Posted October 21, 2011 Seen Metallica at the O2 in London on the DM tour and they were awesome live, no denying that. Seen Megadeth live twice, once on the Rust In Peace Tour 'Clash of the Titans' and once in Newcastle with Testament, either last year or the one before that...Testament easily stole the show that night. After DM I had hoped Metallica would get some momentum, but they've destroyed that with Lou Reed n co. I'm at a loss why Metallica have major problems with production. A band of their stature should be producing top quality recordings, but they're constantly making bad decisions when it comes to producers. Megadeths recent albums for me blow away anything Metallica have done recently. It's a close run thing in the early days for me as well; albums like Ride The Lightning, Peace Sells, Master Of Puppets, So far...so good. No doubt Mustaine as a guitarists pisses all over Hammett. Link to comment
Jocky Balboa Posted October 23, 2011 Share Posted October 23, 2011 Interesting posts here, guys. As far as I see the Metallica vs. Megadeth argument, I agree that Metallica are the better songwriters (purists can say what they want, but there's a reason they're the biggest metal band ever, even bigger than Sabbath, Ozzy and Maiden at any time in their careers) but in a purely technical sense, Megadeth are without doubt the better band. Taking their classic line-up, I would say man for man they are the better players. Although Ellefson isn't as good as Burton or Newsted on bass, Nick Menza could have out-drummed Lars any time, on any stage and Friedman and Mustaine are fabulous guitarists and in a technical sense, trounce Hetfield and Hammett. Any doubters should check out Friedman's pre-Megadeth band, Cacophony. Absolutely unbelievable fret-work on what are two criminally underrated Metal classic albums, "Speed Metal Symphony" and "Go Off!". It says a lot that while Friedman went on to Megadeth, his guitar partner Jason Becker also went on to great things and joined Van Halen frontman Dave Roth's band at the age of 21, replacing the amazing Steve Vai. If not for incurable illness, he would have gone on to become an all-time legend. Unbelievable players. I agree with the production on "Death Magnetic" slightly spoiling an otherwise good return to form (albeit a by-the-numbers, going-through-the-motions, back-to-the-roots cop-out, lol. The only song I thought was pointless was Unforgiven III - the first is one of their best songs ever, the second a decent b-side in the making but a filler as an album track, now a THIRD installment?). It just goes to prove, imo, that it is wrong for their detractors to blame Bob Rock for "ruining Metallica". Rick Rubin came on board for DM, but the result was, sonically speaking, VERY disappointing (again practically no bass and the drum sound is too high in the mix. In fact, the mastering is clipped to fuck as well!) I'd like to think they still have one great album left in them, but this Lulu is NOT it and going by the reactions so far (I've yet to meet anyone who likes it) it is ruining the decent momentum they built up over DM, the tour for that and latterly the brilliant "Big Four" shows around the world. Link to comment
Jack_Glass Posted October 23, 2011 Author Share Posted October 23, 2011 Interesting posts here, guys. As far as I see the Metallica vs. Megadeth argument, I agree that Metallica are the better songwriters (purists can say what they want, but there's a reason they're the biggest metal band ever, even bigger than Sabbath, Ozzy and Maiden at any time in their careers) but in a purely technical sense, Megadeth are without doubt the better band. Taking their classic line-up, I would say man for man they are the better players. Although Ellefson isn't as good as Burton or Newsted on bass, Nick Menza could have out-drummed Lars any time, on any stage and Friedman and Mustaine are fabulous guitarists and in a technical sense, trounce Hetfield and Hammett. Any doubters should check out Friedman's pre-Megadeth band, Cacophony. Absolutely unbelievable fret-work on what are two criminally underrated Metal classic albums, "Speed Metal Symphony" and "Go Off!". It says a lot that while Friedman went on to Megadeth, his guitar partner Jason Becker also went on to great things and joined Van Halen frontman Dave Roth's band at the age of 21, replacing the amazing Steve Vai. If not for incurable illness, he would have gone on to become an all-time legend. Unbelievable players. I agree with the production on "Death Magnetic" slightly spoiling an otherwise good return to form (albeit a by-the-numbers, going-through-the-motions, back-to-the-roots cop-out, lol. The only song I thought was pointless was Unforgiven III - the first is one of their best songs ever, the second a decent b-side in the making but a filler as an album track, now a THIRD installment?). It just goes to prove, imo, that it is wrong for their detractors to blame Bob Rock for "ruining Metallica". Rick Rubin came on board for DM, but the result was, sonically speaking, VERY disappointing (again practically no bass and the drum sound is too high in the mix. In fact, the mastering is clipped to fuck as well!) I'd like to think they still have one great album left in them, but this Lulu is NOT it and going by the reactions so far (I've yet to meet anyone who likes it) it is ruining the decent momentum they built up over DM, the tour for that and latterly the brilliant "Big Four" shows around the world. Good points. It might be unfair to blame the producers without knowing who really has the last say, but any producer worth his salt needs to put his foot down and tell them, "this sounds terrible guys, let's do it again". Has Metallica become so detached from metal & the fans that they think they can chuck out any old crap and we'll all clap our hands? They're fortunate to have the Metallica name as a brand now, otherwise in today's market they would not last long with the nonsense they've been releasing. I think I remember reading an interview with Mustaine who commented on arguably their worst album 'Risk'. He said he let the producer call the shots on it. Once it was released and he read the feedback from fans he decided never to let that happen again. It might be Metallica's interference causing the production issues or it MIGHT be the producers not really giving a fuck about an egocentric band. Either way, the next full Metallica album really needs to deliver top quality production. I certainly don't mind hearing a more raw in your face sound, but I expect the balance of instruments across the production to be even. We've had albums with drums to loud or no bass and Hetfields vocals could do with a tweak as well. If producers can make Ozzy sound good in the studio then there's no excuse for Metallica. Even Mustaines vocals, which I love but are often criticised, on the latest album IMHO sound really good. Link to comment
Jocky Balboa Posted October 23, 2011 Share Posted October 23, 2011 Good points. It might be unfair to blame the producers without knowing who really has the last say, but any producer worth his salt needs to put his foot down and tell them, "this sounds terrible guys, let's do it again". Has Metallica become so detached from metal & the fans that they think they can chuck out any old crap and we'll all clap our hands? They're fortunate to have the Metallica name as a brand now, otherwise in today's market they would not last long with the nonsense they've been releasing. I think I remember reading an interview with Mustaine who commented on arguably their worst album 'Risk'. He said he let the producer call the shots on it. Once it was released and he read the feedback from fans he decided never to let that happen again. It might be Metallica's interference causing the production issues or it MIGHT be the producers not really giving a fuck about an egocentric band. Either way, the next full Metallica album really needs to deliver top quality production. I certainly don't mind hearing a more raw in your face sound, but I expect the balance of instruments across the production to be even. We've had albums with drums to loud or no bass and Hetfields vocals could do with a tweak as well. If producers can make Ozzy sound good in the studio then there's no excuse for Metallica. Even Mustaines vocals, which I love but are often criticised, on the latest album IMHO sound really good. Regarding your first point, I would direct you to the Metal Hammer website and Dom Lawson's video-blog review of Lulu, where he discusses his feelings on their post-1991 output. He echoes your "out of touch with Heavy Metal" sentiment and I would have to agree with you both. The Black Album has been a double-edged sword, imo, in that while it sent them into the stratosphere commercially (and did so much to keep Metal alive amidst the Grunge tidal wave) it blunted their edge dramatically and they have never had the same urgency since. After all, when you have little left to prove and you're so big you could release an album of you playing Disney tunes and still sell a million... I have to say that I had no issue with the production of Load or Re-load, only that there was far too much filler (9 songs on each would've been perfect, or 10 at the very most, rather than 14 and 13 respectively) so Bob Rock is unfairly maligned for this. His record as a Producer is second to none in heavy music (The Cult, Motley Crue and Bon Jovi all successfully reinvented themselves under his guidance... Sonic Temple, Dr. Feelgood and Keep the Faith all did very well and opened up new avenues for these bands). St. Anger wasn't his direction, either. The band deliberately set out to make that album sound as it did. No, blaming Rock is wrong imo and Metallica fanboys should just face up to the fact that their idols lost their edge post-1995. As for Mustaine, I see what you're saying, but distinctly remember when Risk came out and he was making overtures about "cracking the alternative market" and "moving away from my roots" and it was only when Risk failed (still the only pre-2000 album that didn't sell at least 1M worldwide apparently) that he backtracked. I don't doubt all that you say, but just bear in mind that Mustaine has a track record of blaming others for his own fuck-ups (he blamed Marty Friedman for years, for that album's failure, yet Friedman recently revealed he and the band wanted a heavier record, but were over-ruled by Mustaine). Link to comment
Jocky Balboa Posted October 29, 2011 Share Posted October 29, 2011 I've listened to it and I think it sounds utter shit, tbh. It's not even a collection of songs, in the strictest sense, it's more like 2 songs being played at once from either side of the room and trying to play/talk over each other. Production is shit, too. Only marginally less dogshit than St. Anger, sonically. God, they haven't half make it hard to be a fan these last 15yrs, have they? Link to comment
NorthernLights24 Posted November 9, 2011 Share Posted November 9, 2011 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4h7i-zeNHJE Dear Lord make it stop Link to comment
thebladder Posted November 10, 2011 Share Posted November 10, 2011 saw that the other night. Absolutely terrible. Link to comment
tutankamun Posted November 13, 2011 Share Posted November 13, 2011 Lou Reed is a personal hero of mine and The Velvet Underground are one of my favourite bands of all time. However... I hate Metallica for more reasons than just the fact they are a smelly band. Arrogant fuckers. I'll never forget/forgive them for their vandetta against Napster and it's users. I remember Lars stating that he would be willing to physically walk the streets to knock on the door of every single person who used Napster to obtain free music illegally. What a fuckin twat. Rest assured Lars, I have never attempted to download any of your shite 'greaser' music you self centred fuck. Link to comment
dj_bollocks Posted November 13, 2011 Share Posted November 13, 2011 I'd just like another Ride The Lightning / Master Of Puppets please... Link to comment
dj_bollocks Posted November 13, 2011 Share Posted November 13, 2011 And preferably those two remastered... Link to comment
Jocky Balboa Posted November 13, 2011 Share Posted November 13, 2011 Lou Reed is a personal hero of mine and The Velvet Underground are one of my favourite bands of all time. However... I hate Metallica for more reasons than just the fact they are a smelly band. Arrogant fuckers. I'll never forget/forgive them for their vandetta against Napster and it's users. I remember Lars stating that he would be willing to physically walk the streets to knock on the door of every single person who used Napster to obtain free music illegally. What a fuckin twat. Rest assured Lars, I have never attempted to download any of your shite 'greaser' music you self centred fuck. He is a twat, that is true, but while his thoughts were poorly articulated at the time, he has been proved right in many ways re: the implications of downloading. Just look at what it's done to up and coming bands. Link to comment
phoenix Posted November 14, 2011 Share Posted November 14, 2011 Saw the Cameron Crowe film about Pearl Jam - 'Pearl Jam Twenty' on BBC4 on Friday night. Now there was a band.....never knew they were so good and a band of and for the people , not overblown egos like Metallica and Lou Reed.Both these acts have done good stuff and bad but are hardly relevant today. Lou Reed should just let go now and 'Lulu'? Two wrongs don't make it right. Link to comment
Jocky Balboa Posted November 14, 2011 Share Posted November 14, 2011 Saw the Cameron Crowe film about Pearl Jam - 'Pearl Jam Twenty' on BBC4 on Friday night. Now there was a band.....never knew they were so good and a band of and for the people , not overblown egos like Metallica and Lou Reed.Both these acts have done good stuff and bad but are hardly relevant today. Lou Reed should just let go now and 'Lulu'? Two wrongs don't make it right. Metallica hardly relevant? I know they've done considerable damage to their legacy over the last 15yrs (not least with Shyte Anger and now this load of sonic dysentery they call Lulu) but they have just been announced as co-headliner for next year's Download Festival, along with Black Sabbath. Their last album, while far from their best, still sold multi-millions (in this day and age, a miracle). Lou Reed, on the other hand... just a more (pseudo)intellectual Bob Dylan. Link to comment
zappadons Posted November 14, 2011 Share Posted November 14, 2011 Metallica boring. Lou Reed awful. Recipe for a horrid disaster. Link to comment
phoenix Posted November 15, 2011 Share Posted November 15, 2011 Metallica hardly relevant? I know they've done considerable damage to their legacy over the last 15yrs (not least with Shyte Anger and now this load of sonic dysentery they call Lulu) but they have just been announced as co-headliner for next year's Download Festival, along with Black Sabbath. Their last album, while far from their best, still sold multi-millions (in this day and age, a miracle). Lou Reed, on the other hand... just a more (pseudo)intellectual Bob Dylan. Jocky.....I'll stand by my opinion , Lou Reed( 69 ) is older than me and like Dylan( 70 ) , is mebbe only still on the go because he cannot stop or has others whose income depends on him. Both of these guys had things to say about society , especially Dylan. Like Reed , Metallica probably had more to say when they were younger( And Justice For All ) but are not to my mind relevant today , curiousity value apart. I regard Metallica as being more about energy than thoughtful observation. I think marketing has more to do with keeping them on top( keeping the rich in the style to which they are accustomed ). More than ever today , we are being persuaded who and who not to like. It's insidious. None of them have any impact in my world these days but I'm old and understand that they might exercise more of an impact in others. Link to comment
woohoo Posted November 15, 2011 Share Posted November 15, 2011 Metallica Metallica fans Link to comment
Podge Posted November 15, 2011 Share Posted November 15, 2011 Metallica weren't boring back in the 80s, the first 3 albums especially are ace. Thesedays... terrifying. Link to comment
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