Lower Scottish Division

[diamondsr4ever]

Is anyone aware of our scouting network across the lower divisions of Scotland?

 

It seems that any young talent playing in these divisions just dont seem to be up to SPL standard, is this really the case?

[RUL]

This is a bit like a football manager post, next you'll be suggesting we form a link.

 

I don't follow lower league football but I do follow junior/Amateurs and the consensus is that the standard of Junior/Amateur game has never been as bad as it is now. Like you I watch the SPL regularly and I am of the opinion the standard of the SPL has never been worse. Looking at it reasonably, the Pars were the best team in the First Division last season and they are worst promoted team i've seen in a while. Is it a fair assumption to make that the lower leagues are probably shite too.

 

 

 

 

[diamondsr4ever]

This is a bit like a football manager post, next you'll be suggesting we form a link.

 

I don't follow lower league football but I do follow junior/Amateurs and the consensus is that the standard of Junior/Amateur game has never been as bad as it is now. Like you I watch the SPL regularly and I am of the opinion the standard of the SPL has never been worse. Looking at it reasonably, the Pars were the best team in the First Division last season and they are worst promoted team i've seen in a while. Is it a fair assumption to make that the lower leagues are probably shite too.

 

Im not asking if you do follow it, why havent AFC bought anyone from the lower leagues in recent years? is it because the standard is that poor? there must be a few gems floating about? NO?

[RUL]

I thought my post answered your general question, I did appreciate that you had not directly asked RUL for his viewpoint but felt my response clarified your question. Apologies if not, think the answer is clearly NO and that AFC have no money for transfer fees in any case?

 

 

 

 

[tup]

Michael Gardyne of Ross County is easily good enough to play for Aberdeen.

 

There are numerous others.

[diamondsr4ever]

Michael Gardyne of Ross County is easily good enough to play for Aberdeen.

 

There are numerous others.

 

so why no offer, approach? we never seem to be linked with any lower league players, apart fae the hype around Mcallister!

[tup]

so why no offer, approach? we never seem to be linked with any lower league players, apart fae the hype around Mcallister!

 

I imagine they'd be looking for a couple of hundred thousand for him.

 

Same goes for the other good players I would think.

 

Our problem is our club seems to be of a mindset that these players cannot be any good, a lot of the fans are in any case.

 

You buy the player, then you work with him and mould him into the player you want, you spot the potential. Levein is the only one who did this in recent years in Scotland.

 

Ferguson did it to massive effect at Aberdeen.

[diamondsr4ever]

I imagine they'd be looking for a couple of hundred thousand for him.

 

Same goes for the other good players I would think.

 

Our problem is our club seems to be of a mindset that these players cannot be any good, a lot of the fans are in any case.

 

You buy the player, then you work with him and mould him into the player you want, you spot the potential. Levein is the only one who did this in recent years in Scotland.

 

Ferguson did it to massive effect at Aberdeen.

 

It seems after the patterson era there is a fear that we dont look at these leagues, lets buy a journeyman for x amount!

 

i dont follow these leagues, and it would be interesting if we do have a scout that covers these areas

[sheepiekev]

Im not asking if you do follow it, why havent AFC bought anyone from the lower leagues in recent years? is it because the standard is that poor? there must be a few gems floating about? NO?

 

Dundee United have done well from it in recent years;

Conway, Swanson, Gomis (and Bauben?)

 

Craig Robertson is too busy going to watch Colchester v Barnet and the like to notice.

 

I'd imagine we must have people watching the lower leagues though, surely?

[tup]

It seems after the patterson era there is a fear that we dont look at these leagues, lets buy a journeyman for x amount!

 

i dont follow these leagues, and it would be interesting if we do have a scout that covers these areas

 

To be perfectly honest, a scout is no use.

 

It needs to be the manager, he's the one picking the team, he knows what he is looking for, I know if I was in charge I could never buy a player on the say-so of a scout as he may have a totally different idea to your own on what constitutes a good player, and the player may not be what you need.

 

The manager needs to attend the games and spot the raw talent, a player with the attitude to make it in the game, like Levein did with Gomis et al.

 

I'd also loan the likes of Fyvie out to the 2nd division to buck up their ideas and see if they were serious about making a career from the game, to hell with giving them precious status amidst wild claims of multi-million pound values which have no basis in reality.

[diamondsr4ever]

To be perfectly honest, a scout is no use.

 

It needs to be the manager, he's the one picking the team, he knows what he is looking for, I know if I was in charge I could never buy a player on the say-so of a scout as he may have a totally different idea to your own on what constitutes a good player, and the player may not be what you need.

 

The manager needs to attend the games and spot the raw talent, a player with the attitude to make it in the game, like Levein did with Gomis et al.

 

I'd also loan the likes of Fyvie out to the 2nd division to buck up their ideas and see if they were serious about making a career from the game, to hell with giving them precious status amidst wild claims of multi-million pound values which have no basis in reality.

 

fair enough point, maybe the reason why the likes of adams would be a very good fit come time, but if we have no cash its all for feck all anyway

[NorthernLights24]

Dundee United have done well from it in recent years;

Conway, Swanson, Gomis (and Bauben?)

 

Bauben was released by Ajax before he went to United but United have defiantly done very well signing lower league players. Barry Douglas is another one but I believe he was one one league player we did actually try and sign or at least had an interest in.

[Granite City Reds]

Looking at it reasonably, the Pars were the best team in the First Division last season and they are worst promoted team i've seen in a while. Is it a fair assumption to make that the lower leagues are probably shite too.

 

Bit harsh on the lower league there considering they signed in the summer

 

Paul Gallacher (St Mirren)

John Potter (St Mirren)

Kevin Rutkiewicz (St Johnstone)

Jason Thomson (On loan from Hearts)

 

Now if you wonder how they back 4 is terrible then it could be argued that they signed spl players.

[RUL]

Bit harsh on the lower league there considering they signed in the summer

 

Paul Gallacher (St Mirren)

John Potter (St Mirren)

Kevin Rutkiewicz (St Johnstone)

Jason Thomson (On loan from Hearts)

 

Now if you wonder how they back 4 is terrible then it could be argued that they signed spl players.

 

Yeah, think Kev R hasn't played a game for them though and Potter has been dropped, no? Agree with the sentiment though but they obviously felt they had to sign players, maybe manager's got it wrong?

[OneBeboMaguire]

Too simple and sensible for us, we like to go for the English league journeyman approach.

 

Leave Broon to it

[Byrne Baby Byrne]

I'm sure there are plenty of good players in the 1st division and below, but it seems we are not interested. League 1 & 2 reserves leagues is where our interests lie. And somehow Algerian under 23 matches.

 

Griffiths, Murray Davidson, Ryan Stevenson & Bryson are others who have come up from the lower leagues and done well.

[fine-n-dandy]

Temleton (oh wait too small)

[diamondsr4ever]

A network of scouts can recommend a player for the manager to take a further look at - anything less than that means we're limiting ourself to the odd contact a manager might have and Craig Robertson.

 

Anyway, there would be outrage if we had a few players from lower league Scottish clubs, they wouldn't get a chance as too many folk want a "big name" and spit the dummy out if results don't come straight away.

 

REALITY IS THERE WILL BE NO BIG NAMES AT THE CLUB IN THE NEAR FUTURE.

[spamspamspam]

A network of scouts can recommend a player for the manager to take a further look at - anything less than that means we're limiting ourself to the odd contact a manager might have and Craig Robertson.

 

Anyway, there would be outrage if we had a few players from lower league Scottish clubs, they wouldn't get a chance as too many folk want a "big name" and spit the dummy out if results don't come straight away.

 

Think this is the biggest issue, well for us anyway. CL knew he had a job for life at Utd, unless they went down or he was offered something interesting in Englanshire. Meant he could take players up and spend 2-3 years developing them knowing he'd see the fruits of his labour and would have the time to fill the gaps they had in their football.

 

Magennis was signed for this IMO, fast, athletic, just needs a football brain inserted. However we don't play reserve football, we only give 1 year deals (how much development can a club do in a year?) and out fans will happily destroy any player on the pitch at a whim. Not exactly the right environment to give someone a chance to learn his trade.

[Ke1t]

How many scouts does the club employ?

[THE GRIM SHEEPER]

Nicky Riley and Matt Lockwood at Dundee would walk in to our team

[dj_bollocks]

See I can see two sides to the United situation... One, all the positive stuff that's been said about developing and training and cherry picking young uns, but then they're also in financial shit - and I'm asking because I don't know the answer - is that because of the way they've acquired this talent, how much did it cost them and was it a speculate to accumulate scenario...

 

Either way, wouldn't we all love to see our club have some ambition when it comes to talent, signings and development.... Face it we just don't have what it takes... Even if we sold Fyvie, Jack, Megginson etc for reasonable bucks, we wouldn't see that redistributed back into players, we know that for a fact qv Anderson, Maguire etc etc...

[goteborg83]

even Mackay-Steven is playing well at Dundee utd at the moment. definitely some good players in the lower leagues

[K-9]

I thought my post answered your general question, I did appreciate that you had not directly asked RUL for his viewpoint but felt my response clarified your question. Apologies if not, think the answer is clearly NO and that AFC have no money for transfer fees in any case?

Lower league players also run out of contracts!!

[tup]

Thon gadgie at Falkirk. Al Aguarai or fitever his name is.

 

Out of contract soon, the new Russell Latapy, another who came from lower down, Didier Agathe, (spit) Nacho Novo, none of them even looked at by Aberdeen.

[Byrne Baby Byrne]

Think this is the biggest issue, well for us anyway. CL knew he had a job for life at Utd, unless they went down or he was offered something interesting in Englanshire. Meant he could take players up and spend 2-3 years developing them knowing he'd see the fruits of his labour and would have the time to fill the gaps they had in their football.

 

Magennis was signed for this IMO, fast, athletic, just needs a football brain inserted. However we don't play reserve football, we only give 1 year deals (how much development can a club do in a year?) and out fans will happily destroy any player on the pitch at a whim. Not exactly the right environment to give someone a chance to learn his trade.

 

 

Abso-bollock-lutely.

 

If we signed young players from a Berwick or a Cowdenbeath then they would be up against it from Day 1 from elements of our support, even if we as fans were told that this was the directio we were looking to go down. There's an Old Firm mentality to an element to our support, in that the first defeat to a St Mirren our young team with lower league players would be written off as being shite.

 

The club certainly needs to take a long term view as to where we're heading, but large sections of our support are more than prone to short term-ism also.

 

I tend to be patient with managers and players but I cant see Magennis being anything other than shite. I sometimes wonder just how bad a goalkeeper he must have been if he is better as a striker

[tup]

I tend to be patient with managers and players but I cant see Magennis being anything other than shite. I sometimes wonder just how bad a goalkeeper he must have been if he is better as a striker

 

Once you are in as a professional footballer, it's almost impossible to be out again, provided you live your life outside well, even if you're shite, as Darren and Derek Young so eloquently testify.

[ericblack4boss]

i wa stold that the East Fife left back was outstanding against us in the League Cup tie this season anyone recall his name