It's 2008 over again - can the FMB afford NOT to act?

[Jocky Balboa]

When I first joined this Board in early 2008, many like myself were slated for agreeing with Brian Irvine when he said "an overrated European campaign has simply papered over the cracks of our true position", yet our agreement was tempered by the fact we saw that season as a golden opportunity to kick on. Instead, the Board didn't accept - until it was too late - we had a manager who, despite being a good short-term appointment, was not capable of winning a trophy, who saw "top 6 every year" as an achievement and, worst of all, referred to the "European adventure" as a fun, one-off experience, rather than one we should aspire to repeat. 

As a result of Board inaction, we continued into long-term stagnation, barely scraping the Top 6 trophy in April 2008 and again the following season, before McGhee took a squad of underachievers and (rather predictably) utterly failed. We took many years to recover, on and off the pitch. 

The parallels between that season and today are alarming; with the squad of players at their disposal and the mediocre SPL - arguably weaker than 2008 - we should be shooting for 3rd place once more, yet all we have are excuses about Europe tiring the (relatively young squad of) players and no clear vision of what Robson is trying to do. If we don't get group stage European football next season, a truly amazing, game-changing opportunity will be squandered.

With the £6m European windfall, another League Cup final run and potential sales of decent players, can we trust in the present management team to spend it wisely? Put simply, can the FMB afford NOT to sack Robson at this stage, given what we stand to lose from his continued fumbling?

[1903Fitba]

NRT

[Dandyesque]

11 minutes ago, Jocky Balboa said:

When I first joined this Board in early 2008, many like myself were slated for agreeing with Brian Irvine when he said "an overrated European campaign has simply papered over the cracks of our true position", yet our agreement was tempered by the fact we saw that season as a golden opportunity to kick on. Instead, the Board didn't accept - until it was too late - we had a manager who, despite being a good short-term appointment, was not capable of winning a trophy, who saw "top 6 every year" as an achievement and, worst of all, referred to the "European adventure" as a fun, one-off experience, rather than one we should aspire to repeat. 

As a result of Board inaction, we continued into long-term stagnation, barely scraping the Top 6 trophy in April 2008 and again the following season, before McGhee took a squad of underachievers and (rather predictably) utterly failed. We took many years to recover, on and off the pitch. 

The parallels between that season and today are alarming; with the squad of players at their disposal and the mediocre SPL - arguably weaker than 2008 - we should be shooting for 3rd place once more, yet all we have are excuses about Europe tiring the (relatively young squad of) players and no clear vision of what Robson is trying to do. If we don't get group stage European football next season, a truly amazing, game-changing opportunity will be squandered.

With the £6m European windfall, another League Cup final run and potential sales of decent players, can we trust in the present management team to spend it wisely? Put simply, can the FMB afford NOT to sack Robson at this stage, given what we stand to lose from his continued fumbling?

What I got from your reasoning is we shouldn't appoint Mark McGhee again.

Everything else was just waffle.

[Jocky Balboa]

18 minutes ago, Dandyesque said:

What I got from your reasoning is we shouldn't appoint Mark McGhee again.

Everything else was just waffle.

With respect, what I was saying is that the rot set in long before McGhee took over. The European run (enjoyable though it was) simply masked bigger issues and while Brian Irvine was slated for saying it, with the benefit of hindsight he has been proven correct. It was complete folly to give Calderwood a 3 year extension that year when, with the exception of the Euro run, he did little to merit it. Once he completed his original task of restoring respectability, it became clear he had neither the plan nor the ability to take us further. 

We are in a similar position this year, in that we have a European financial windfall and experience at a decent level, which *should* being the players up a level, yet a mediocre management team will hold us back, just like 2008.

[Jocky Balboa]

29 minutes ago, 1903Fitba said:

NRT

Seriously? You can't take 30s to read a few paragraphs, but will no doubt take far longer to trawl and troll on social media. Nice way of saying you have the attention span of a goldfish. 🙄

[WesthillWanderersFC]

38 minutes ago, Jocky Balboa said:

When I first joined this Board in early 2008, many like myself were slated for agreeing with Brian Irvine when he said "an overrated European campaign has simply papered over the cracks of our true position", yet our agreement was tempered by the fact we saw that season as a golden opportunity to kick on. Instead, the Board didn't accept - until it was too late - we had a manager who, despite being a good short-term appointment, was not capable of winning a trophy, who saw "top 6 every year" as an achievement and, worst of all, referred to the "European adventure" as a fun, one-off experience, rather than one we should aspire to repeat. 

As a result of Board inaction, we continued into long-term stagnation, barely scraping the Top 6 trophy in April 2008 and again the following season, before McGhee took a squad of underachievers and (rather predictably) utterly failed. We took many years to recover, on and off the pitch. 

The parallels between that season and today are alarming; with the squad of players at their disposal and the mediocre SPL - arguably weaker than 2008 - we should be shooting for 3rd place once more, yet all we have are excuses about Europe tiring the (relatively young squad of) players and no clear vision of what Robson is trying to do. If we don't get group stage European football next season, a truly amazing, game-changing opportunity will be squandered.

With the £6m European windfall, another League Cup final run and potential sales of decent players, can we trust in the present management team to spend it wisely? Put simply, can the FMB afford NOT to sack Robson at this stage, given what we stand to lose from his continued fumbling?

Not reading all that but Cormack made it abundantly clear that the arse is not getting sacked any time soon.

Unfortunately, because there’s no way we’ll progress with his approach & tactics. 

 

[Jocky Balboa]

2 minutes ago, WesthillWanderersFC said:

Not reading all that but Cormack made it abundantly clear that the arse is not getting sacked any time soon.

Unfortunately, because there’s no way we’ll progress with his approach & tactics. 

Seriously? It was a few paragraphs, not War and Peace, for goodness sake. Have attention spans really plummeted that much since debates like this were commonplace in 2008? 😲🤔

Your conclusion is one I very much agree with, however. Starting Hayes for once thing, had me shaking my head in disbelief. Polvara being benched was another. While Glass failed, I could at least see what he was trying to achieve. He was shafted by poor recruitment as well. With Robson, I just don't see any consistency, or vision of what he's trying to achieve.

[Parklife]

It's hee haw like 2008. 
 

DYA. 

[Dons79]

12 minutes ago, Jocky Balboa said:

Seriously? It was a few paragraphs, not War and Peace, for goodness sake. Have attention spans really plummeted that much since debates like this were commonplace in 2008? 😲🤔

Your conclusion is one I very much agree with, however. Starting Hayes for once thing, had me shaking my head in disbelief. Polvara being benched was another. While Glass failed, I could at least see what he was trying to achieve. He was shafted by poor recruitment as well. With Robson, I just don't see any consistency, or vision of what he's trying to achieve.

I read it jockey, took all of 50 seconds, it’s nothing like 2008, we have a team of quality players unlike 2008, there’s not any chance of relegation(IMO unlike 2008), the chairman is willing to put money into the club, unlike 2008, we are managerially rudderless, manager pish/ DOF pish, just like 2008, that’s were the comparisons end, same outcome as 2008, we win fuck all of importance ever. 
the end.

[RAZOR]

El canz doth flow.

[Jocky Balboa]

7 minutes ago, Dons79 said:

I read it jockey, took all of 50 seconds, it’s nothing like 2008, we have a team of quality players unlike 2008, there’s not any chance of relegation(IMO unlike 2008), the chairman is willing to put money into the club, unlike 2008, we are managerially rudderless, manager pish/ DOF pish, just like 2008, that’s were the comparisons end, same outcome as 2008, we win fuck all of importance ever. 
the end.

First of all, thank you for the constructive response, much appreciated.

That said, while I agree we have a better pool of players and a Chairman who is investing, what I allude to is the missed opportunity we had; if we kicked on from that Euro run, for example not shyting the bed in the semi-finals against Dundee Utd and QOTS (I can scarcely believe those debacles, even today!) and managing more than one 3rd place finish in 5 years, we could have repeated the Euro feat and made tens of millions. Calderwood had by far and away the 4th biggest budget every year, against a Hearts team with money but who were in disarray, changing managers constantly. 3rd was there for the taking, but JC had neither the ambition, drive nor the ability to realise it and saw "Top 6 every year" as an achievement.

While you rightly make distinctions between now and then, where I feel the comparison stands up, is in what we stand to lose in the longer term, if we persist with a set-up that clearly isn't working. I fear we could be looking back in 10-15 years, after no more group stage European football - and possibly no trophies - lamenting the missed opportunity we had this season.

[1903Fitba]

41 minutes ago, Jocky Balboa said:

Seriously? You can't take 30s to read a few paragraphs, but will no doubt take far longer to trawl and troll on social media. Nice way of saying you have the attention span of a goldfish. 🙄

NRT x2

[Dynamo]

1 hour ago, Jocky Balboa said:

When I first joined this Board in early 2008, many like myself were slated for agreeing with Brian Irvine when he said "an overrated European campaign has simply papered over the cracks of our true position", yet our agreement was tempered by the fact we saw that season as a golden opportunity to kick on. Instead, the Board didn't accept - until it was too late - we had a manager who, despite being a good short-term appointment, was not capable of winning a trophy, who saw "top 6 every year" as an achievement and, worst of all, referred to the "European adventure" as a fun, one-off experience, rather than one we should aspire to repeat. 

As a result of Board inaction, we continued into long-term stagnation, barely scraping the Top 6 trophy in April 2008 and again the following season, before McGhee took a squad of underachievers and (rather predictably) utterly failed. We took many years to recover, on and off the pitch. 

The parallels between that season and today are alarming; with the squad of players at their disposal and the mediocre SPL - arguably weaker than 2008 - we should be shooting for 3rd place once more, yet all we have are excuses about Europe tiring the (relatively young squad of) players and no clear vision of what Robson is trying to do. If we don't get group stage European football next season, a truly amazing, game-changing opportunity will be squandered.

With the £6m European windfall, another League Cup final run and potential sales of decent players, can we trust in the present management team to spend it wisely? Put simply, can the FMB afford NOT to sack Robson at this stage, given what we stand to lose from his continued fumbling?

TL;DR.

JMG.

[Daisy1903]

40 minutes ago, Jocky Balboa said:

Seriously? It was a few paragraphs, not War and Peace, for goodness sake. Have attention spans really plummeted that much since debates like this were commonplace in 2008? 😲🤔

Your conclusion is one I very much agree with, however. Starting Hayes for once thing, had me shaking my head in disbelief. Polvara being benched was another. While Glass failed, I could at least see what he was trying to achieve. He was shafted by poor recruitment as well. With Robson, I just don't see any consistency, or vision of what he's trying to achieve.

Polvara is pish and he's not in contention for Hayes place anywsy. McGarry is the only competition for his place and he's also pish. In fact Polvara, McGarry and Roos were all at fault for the goal and can all fuck off for being regularly pish, have always been pish and will never be any better than pish. Hayes can retire in the knowledge he was good and got pish as he got older.

And Glass? Fuck me. Given what we had in place, he has to go down as one of the worst decisions in the history of our club.

It's such a stupid argument to say you could see what Glass was trying to achieve and not Robson. I think Robson should go put it's pretty obvious to anyone with eyes he wants to hit teams on the break with a fast and direct plays from the back. It's probably one of the easiest team identities there is to see

[Baaaaa heid]

2 minutes ago, Daisy1903 said:

Polvara is pish and he's not in contention for Hayes place anywsy. McGarry is the only competition for his place and he's also pish. In fact Polvara, McGarry and Roos were all at fault for the goal and can all fuck off for being regularly pish, have always been pish and will never be any better than pish. Hayes can retire in the knowledge he was good and got pish as he got older.

And Glass? Fuck me. Given what we had in place, he has to go down as one of the worst decisions in the history of our club.

It's such a stupid argument to say you could see what Glass was trying to achieve and not Robson. I think Robson should go put it's pretty obvious to anyone with eyes he wants to hit teams on the break with a fast and direct plays from the back. It's probably one of the easiest team identities there is to see

Fast a direct = hoofball