Boxing Fans

[Don Fonte]

12 hours ago, NEM said:

Fury by a mile.

Anyone watch the boxing tonight? Josh Kelly fell apart pretty quickly 

Won a treble on the boxing last night with Avanesyan to win bringing it home.

Josh Kelly been overhyped from the start.

[NEM]

7 hours ago, minijc said:

Avanesyan was very good, some brutal shots, think Kelly is good enough to come back and fight at a decent level still but a beating like that often leaves a mark on a fighter.

 

this will also leave a mark on a man too.

Bad craic from Valdez that

 

5 hours ago, Don Fonte said:

Won a treble on the boxing last night with Avanesyan to win bringing it home.

Josh Kelly been overhyped from the start.

Nice one.  Kelly looking like he's all style no substance.  Folded like a deckchair last night when the pressure was turned up

[minijc]

With the celebration?  Bit ott given the boy has is there poleaxed like. 

[NEM]

23 minutes ago, minijc said:

With the celebration?  Bit ott given the boy has is there poleaxed like. 

Aye - cunt could be deed and he’s bouncing around right beside him

[minijc]

Parker there with a touch from the judges, dreadful fight and performance from him, Fa was there to spoil but he have several better rounds.

[minijc]

3 minutes ago, Roberto said:

I didn't see it but Twitter up in arms about it.

Chisora next?

Hopefully Parker stays away from spiders this time...

Based on that he should retire, doesn't seem to have the hunger in him.

[NEM]

4 hours ago, Roberto said:

Routine.... Canelo.

Roll on the Saunders fight.

Turk was a no hoper. Saunders be a far better test

[minijc]

11 minutes ago, Roberto said:

I'm a tad disappointed in myself for getting up for it. Was as one sided as I expected it to be, and had convinced myself not to get up for it... and like a complete dick, I did.

May 8th Saunders Canelo, that will be a far better watch, any word on where it will be held? I still can't see past Canelo however.

I'd guess Vegas as first choice as it's the weekend of Cinco De Mayo, if Vegas isn't fully open I'll guess at somewhere in Texas.

[minijc]

5 minutes ago, Roberto said:

Yeah I suspected Vegas. Which makes me jealous cause again another fight that being at would be class.

I see Tyson Fury has stated the Joshua fight is no closer due to venue. 

Yeah I would love to be at this one, especially considering I can get 4 nights free on the weekend of the fight.  Love Billy Joe, been a big fan of his and think this is the perfect fight for him, with fair judges he has a huge chance.

[NEM]

1 hour ago, Roberto said:

I'm a tad disappointed in myself for getting up for it. Was as one sided as I expected it to be, and had convinced myself not to get up for it... and like a complete dick, I did.

May 8th Saunders Canelo, that will be a far better watch, any word on where it will be held? I still can't see past Canelo however.

I only got up cause the bairn wanted to - couldn’t wake the lazy little shit ??‍♂️?

 

Be Vegas surely. Was rumours of Taylor v Ramirez on the same night 

[NEM]

10 minutes ago, Roberto said:

Ramirez Taylor contract signed.

Superb.

They give a date and venue?

[Don Fonte]

Aye Vegas, would guess a decent amount of fans in.

[NEM]

1 hour ago, Don Fonte said:

Aye Vegas, would guess a decent amount of fans in.

Slim to no chance of being allowed over for it.  Shame he'd have a decent following usually

[Don Fonte]

6 minutes ago, NEM said:

Slim to no chance of being allowed over for it.  Shame he'd have a decent following usually

No fans over for it, agreed. People in Vegas yes. Vegas is still semi open now.

[Shinniesta]

RIP Marvelous Marvin Hagler. A proper legend he was as hard as fucking nails. He was perhaps pound for pound the best boxer of the 1980's.

I have a pair of boxing gloves one signed by Hagler the other by Thomas Hearns. It's value has probably gone up now but I'll never sell it.

[Don Fonte]

31 minutes ago, Roberto said:

It's signed.

Fury Joshua. 

No site chosen yet though. My guess is Saudi Arabia in June.

[Don Fonte]

6 hours ago, Roberto said:

Shannon Courtenay vs Ebanie Bridges for title in April.

???

Ebanie Bridges' chebs. Oh my.

[Don Fonte]

[Redforever86]

Okolie looked decent there. 

[Zeus]

Watched it on hesgoals last night, worked perfectly.  

Good KO but hard to judge Whyte based on that. 

Povetkin is done. 

[Don Fonte]

6 hours ago, Zeus said:

Watched it on hesgoals last night, worked perfectly.  

Good KO but hard to judge Whyte based on that. 

Povetkin is done. 

Aye Povetkin is shot to shit. Has been for a while but just found a cracking punch last time. Time for him to quit.

[NEM]

20 minutes ago, Don Fonte said:

Aye Povetkin is shot to shit. Has been for a while but just found a cracking punch last time. Time for him to quit.

Looked unsteady as fuck on his feet from a couple of glancing blows in the first then took an absolute monster of an overhand right on the chin no problem a few rounds later.  Was weird ?

 

Anyone see Willie Hutchison getting chinned on BT?  Bad one that - was fucked after the first dig 

[Don Fonte]

37 minutes ago, NEM said:

Looked unsteady as fuck on his feet from a couple of glancing blows in the first then took an absolute monster of an overhand right on the chin no problem a few rounds later.  Was weird ?

 

Anyone see Willie Hutchison getting chinned on BT?  Bad one that - was fucked after the first dig 

Aye he looked fucked then took some bombs.

Just watched the knockout there, brutal. Hutchison was getting touted for big things too.

[Jocky Balboa]

On 3/14/2021 at 8:49 PM, Shinniesta said:

RIP Marvelous Marvin Hagler. A proper legend he was as hard as fucking nails. He was perhaps pound for pound the best boxer of the 1980's.

I have a pair of boxing gloves one signed by Hagler the other by Thomas Hearns. It's value has probably gone up now but I'll never sell it.

He was an incredible boxer, an all-time great for sure.

[Jocky Balboa]

Here's a topic worthy of some hot debate - is Mike Tyson really an all-time great, or a media hype?

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.boxingnews24.com/2018/05/was-mike-tyson-overrated/%3famp

This is one of many articles that says the latter and it's hard to disagree with what he says here. 

My general take on it is that, while he peaked very early (no-one can say what would have happened if Cus D'amato hadn't passed so early in his career) there are several key points against him being one of the greats:

1. He did very well to clean up his division in the first 4 or so years. However, he never beat an all-time great in their prime; 

- Larry Holmes had been retired for two years and at 38, was way past his best.

- Berbick beat a caricature of Muhammad Ali and was never anything more than a decent fighter who overachieved.

- Wasn't Spinks a natural Light-Heavyweight who moved up and was overmatched?

- Bruno (both times) was as much a case of Bruno beating himself - his fear had him defeated before he stepped in the ring

2. He never got off the canvas to win a fight, like many greats. Every time someone successfully stood up to his bullyboy tactics, he had no Plan B and lost.

3. He never avenged any of his defeats, unlike many greats.

- Buster Douglas had just lost his mother and fought the fight of his life, against a Tyson who was complacent, that is true, but the latter had never truly been tested and when finally put to the sword, he folded

- People remember the Holyfield double header for the ear-biting incident, but forget that Holyfield dominated the first fight and was on his way to winning the second - tell me Tyson didn't do this as a way out via disqualification?

- He asked Lennox Lewis for a rematch at the end of the first, but looking at the way the first fight went (Lewis outclassed him in almost all rounds) he would have embarrassed himself in the process

So all in all, I would have to say that he deserves credit for his early peak years, albeit in a weak era, but overall I'd say he's not even an all-time great heavyweight, far less a great boxer overall. I think Ali, Foreman and Sonny Liston, among others, would have hammered him.

[Guest milne_afc]

1 hour ago, Jocky Balboa said:

I think Ali, Foreman and Sonny Liston, among others, would have hammered him.

He’d beat them all right now though 

[NEM]

14 hours ago, Jocky Balboa said:

Here's a topic worthy of some hot debate - is Mike Tyson really an all-time great, or a media hype?

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.boxingnews24.com/2018/05/was-mike-tyson-overrated/%3famp

This is one of many articles that says the latter and it's hard to disagree with what he says here. 

My general take on it is that, while he peaked very early (no-one can say what would have happened if Cus D'amato hadn't passed so early in his career) there are several key points against him being one of the greats:

1. He did very well to clean up his division in the first 4 or so years. However, he never beat an all-time great in their prime; 

- Larry Holmes had been retired for two years and at 38, was way past his best.

- Berbick beat a caricature of Muhammad Ali and was never anything more than a decent fighter who overachieved.

- Wasn't Spinks a natural Light-Heavyweight who moved up and was overmatched?

- Bruno (both times) was as much a case of Bruno beating himself - his fear had him defeated before he stepped in the ring

2. He never got off the canvas to win a fight, like many greats. Every time someone successfully stood up to his bullyboy tactics, he had no Plan B and lost.

3. He never avenged any of his defeats, unlike many greats.

- Buster Douglas had just lost his mother and fought the fight of his life, against a Tyson who was complacent, that is true, but the latter had never truly been tested and when finally put to the sword, he folded

- People remember the Holyfield double header for the ear-biting incident, but forget that Holyfield dominated the first fight and was on his way to winning the second - tell me Tyson didn't do this as a way out via disqualification?

- He asked Lennox Lewis for a rematch at the end of the first, but looking at the way the first fight went (Lewis outclassed him in almost all rounds) he would have embarrassed himself in the process

So all in all, I would have to say that he deserves credit for his early peak years, albeit in a weak era, but overall I'd say he's not even an all-time great heavyweight, far less a great boxer overall. I think Ali, Foreman and Sonny Liston, among others, would have hammered him.

Holyfield and Lewis especially fought a shell.  Tyson was never the same after he left jail.

 

Buster Douglas fight he was knocking back champagne in the dressing room before it

[Jocky Balboa]

3 hours ago, NEM said:

Holyfield and Lewis especially fought a shell.  Tyson was never the same after he left jail.

 

Buster Douglas fight he was knocking back champagne in the dressing room before it

Did Holyfield fight a shell, or was he just a better fighter than many gave him credit for? I've heard a lot of people say Evander was a blown-up Cruiserweight, but going into the first Tyson fight he was a real underdog, after Tyson swept away journeymen on his comeback, but in the first fight he dominated the supposed "baddest man on the planet" and deservedly stopped him late on. In the second, he was on his way to another victory, hence why it's no stretch to say Tyson bit his ear to get a disqualification as a way out.

Holyfield's career is impressive overall. The man could take one hell of a beating. 

Lewis additionally may have fought a Tyson past his best (not his fault, but Lewis was paid to step aside in the past by Tyson's camp - I wonder why?) but I'm not convinced "prime Tyson" would have beaten peak Lewis, the former always struggled against big guys who had stamina. Lewis was a formidable fighter who was better than many (especially Tyson fanboys) gave him credit for. 

I'm taking nothing away from early Tyson, except to point out he never beat an all-time great in their prime (as I said, Holmes was 38 and retired for a few years, way past his best) and despite the post-jail hype, fought mostly journeymen and lost every time someone stood up to his bullyboy tactics. Great puncher, but when he didn't get an early knockout he always struggled.

[NEM]

3 minutes ago, Jocky Balboa said:

Did Holyfield fight a shell, or was he just a better fighter than many gave him credit for? I've heard a lot of people say Evander was a blown-up Cruiserweight, but going into the first Tyson fight he was a real underdog, after Tyson swept away journeymen on his comeback, but in the first fight he dominated the supposed "baddest man on the planet" and deservedly stopped him late on. In the second, he was on his way to another victory, hence why it's no stretch to say Tyson bit his ear to get a disqualification as a way out.

Holyfield's career is impressive overall. The man could take one hell of a beating. 

Lewis additionally may have fought a Tyson past his best (not his fault, but Lewis was paid to step aside in the past by Tyson's camp - I wonder why?) but I'm not convinced "prime Tyson" would have beaten peak Lewis, the former always struggled against big guys who had stamina. Lewis was a formidable fighter who was better than many (especially Tyson fanboys) gave him credit for. 

I'm taking nothing away from early Tyson, except to point out he never beat an all-time great in their prime (as I said, Holmes was 38 and retired for a few years, way past his best) and despite the post-jail hype, fought mostly journeymen and lost every time someone stood up to his bullyboy tactics. Great puncher, but when he didn't get an early knockout he always struggled.

Holyfield an all time great but he wouldn't have bullied a prime Tyson the way he did imo.

Real shame Cus d' Amato died when he did - he'd have hopefully kept Tyson on the straight and narrow.  Was a wrecking machine at his peak - not his fault the quality of opposition wasn't as high as previously.

 

[Jocky Balboa]

4 hours ago, NEM said:

Holyfield an all time great but he wouldn't have bullied a prime Tyson the way he did imo.

Real shame Cus d' Amato died when he did - he'd have hopefully kept Tyson on the straight and narrow.  Was a wrecking machine at his peak - not his fault the quality of opposition wasn't as high as previously.

 

Again, good post. That said, while I agree a prime Tyson would have been more formidable against Holyfield and Lewis, I'm still not convinced he would have reversed the results. As you say, he was a wrecking machine, but by the same token, it's also true that he was one-dimensional in that regard, hence why he always struggled against "big" heavyweights who both knew how to face him down AND had no fear. 

I'm certainly not suggesting you're one, but his apologists make all kinds of excuses for him, such as his post-jail troubles, but Muhammad Ali was jailed and, despite a rocky comeback at first, went on to become arguably the greatest heavyweight of them all. Tyson was afforded every opportunity to come back stronger, like Ali; the money, the hype, the box office... he had it all, yet ducked Foreman and, for many years, avoided Lewis. 

For me Tyson is not, as some suggest, the most overrated of them all, but I don't think he's an all-time great, either. The hype is greater than his record. He wasn't the "baddest man on the planet", he was the biggest bully and like all bullies, he met his match whenever people stood up to him. I would put Ali, Foreman and a few others ahead of him in the GOAT heavyweight category alone.