Scotland V Peru & Mexico

[Scotty_Toronto]

I've been to Peru. Chickens on spits everywhere. And about 200 varieties of potato.

 

Fit like are their Lima beans?

[robbojunior]

Surely Scotland could do worse than playing shinnie RB.

[V for Vendetta]

Surely Scotland could do worse than playing shinnie RB.

Not sure he'd be the answer there tbh, I've only seen him play RB once (for ICT) and while he was ok wasn't that impressed.

[DD1903]

Watched it.

 

So... Atmosphere was great and will be a good experience for the players.

 

4 at the back this time - not sure if that's to stay or not

 

Shinnie is more mobile than McGeoch but McGeoch better suited to the holding role really.

 

Sorry to say I see no point whatsoever in capping Stevenson at 30. This is something I've moaned about before - a lot of players need 10-15 caps under their belt before they really perform at international level absolute zero point starting that process with a 30 year old.

 

Archer really was crap and shouldn't be back anytime soon.

 

Otherwise we were solid enough against a decent team if a bit stuffy and not really in possession much.

 

If we are playing a defensive 4-5-1 we need to work out how hr fuck to get the ball up the park and make it stick, no idea how this would work with Griffiths who is our best striker by a mile. Maybe a 4-4-1-1 type of thing with Griffiths in behind so someone.

 

Oh and Peru looked good but not anything like 11th in the world imo.

Does Jordan archer not get 10-15 games to really start performing at international level?!

[V for Vendetta]

Does Jordan archer not get 10-15 games to really start performing at international level?!

If you'd seen his gaffes you wouldn't need to ask!

[RAZOR]

Not sure he'd be the answer there tbh, I've only seen him play RB once (for ICT) and while he was ok wasn't that impressed.

Did he nae win the Scottish Cup at RB?

 

Again though. I think Callum Paterson is the better of the two.

[DD1903]

If you'd seen his gaffes you wouldn't need to ask!

I have

 

But, you said it takes 10-15 games to start performing at international level...does that not apply to goalkeepers? Or did you just pluck that figure out of no where?! ?

[DelMonte]

Players need 10 to 16 caps before they perform

 

Where was that plucked from?

 

Utter tosh

 

Steve Tosh

Aye it's nae necessarily true but what we don't do in Scotland is give young players caps soon enough.

 

Look at Northern Ireland. They have players on 50-100 caps and are experienced in international football. We have the likes of Stuart Armstrong who is 25 and only has 6 caps. I do realise this is because N.I have a smaller pool to pick from but it clearly benefits them.

[thomsod]

The problem with Patterson, is he's not playing right back for Cardiff. He's playing midfield for them.

[RAZOR]

The problem with Patterson, is he's not playing right back for Cardiff. He's playing midfield for them.

 

As is Shinnie for us?

[V for Vendetta]

Did he nae win the Scottish Cup at RB?

 

Again though. I think Callum Paterson is the better of the two.

 

I think you and I had this convo before.

 

From what I recall (i was at the game with Falkirk mates) he started at RB, wasn't particularly involved (by his standards at the tome) and was then moved into midfield I think - at which point he had much more impact.

 

So if anything, seems like evidence he's a bit wasted at RB.

[V for Vendetta]

The problem with Patterson, is he's not playing right back for Cardiff. He's playing midfield for them.

 

He's also defensively quite poor as seen in the recent international games he has played.

 

Shame but he needs game time at RB really.

[V for Vendetta]

As is Shinnie for us?

 

Further forward than Shinnie does for us.

[DD1903]

He talks some amount of huey

 

Many starts did mckenna need to look the part?

I think it'll be another 6-11 starts

[RAZOR]

Further forward than Shinnie does for us.

My point was that he doesn't play in the same position people so badly want him at.

[V for Vendetta]

I think it'll be another 6-11 starts

 

McKenna walked straight into it and was great. He's something of an exception though and many players do have a settling in period when stepping up a level.

 

Why do you think so much was made of Peru having 500 caps between the starting line up and our team only having 50ish? Is it because all our players can just play international football quality football on their debut or is it because experience is important at international level?

 

My problem with Scotland is we wait too long to give players a chance and too often start handing caps out to players when they are 28/29 - instead of trying them out/bedding them in when they are 24/25.

 

A 28/29 will likely only feature for 1 or 2 campaigns at most.

 

Get the right players in earlier, help them develop international players and then you might have someone who can be part of 3 or 4 campaigns instead. That's how you get a team with 500+ caps on the park.

[V for Vendetta]

My point was that he doesn't play in the same position people so badly want him at.

 

Yep I know, just trying to help chief.

[DD1903]

 

McKenna walked straight into it and was great. He's something of an exception though and many players do have a settling in period when stepping up a level.

 

Why do you think so much was made of Peru having 500 caps between the starting line up and our team only having 50ish? Is it because all our players can just play international football quality football on their debut or is it because experience is important at international level?

 

My problem with Scotland is we wait too long to give players a chance and too often start handing caps out to players when they are 28/29 - instead of trying them out/bedding them in when they are 24/25.

 

A 28/29 will likely only feature for 1 or 2 campaigns at most.

 

Get the right players in earlier, help them develop international players and then you might have someone who can be part of 3 or 4 campaigns instead. That's how you get a team with 500+ caps on the park.

Go back and read what you said again. I was pulling you up for your contradictions. Players need 10-15 games to settle. archer shouldn't be back in again. Which is it?

[V for Vendetta]

Go back and read what you said again. I was pulling you up for your contradictions. Players need 10-15 games to settle. archer shouldn't be back in again. Which is it?

"Pulling me up" - like some kind of blog police? Cool.

 

I don't need to read what I wrote, it's not really that complicated.

 

The answer is: both. (Life's not black and white like a chat forum)

 

I'd have given Archer the benefit of the doubt but having watched it his performance was so bad I don't think we can afford to have him back in too soon. Maybe in time.

[Tyzo_1903]

 

McKenna walked straight into it and was great. He's something of an exception though and many players do have a settling in period when stepping up a level.

 

Why do you think so much was made of Peru having 500 caps between the starting line up and our team only having 50ish? Is it because all our players can just play international football quality football on their debut or is it because experience is important at international level?

 

My problem with Scotland is we wait too long to give players a chance and too often start handing caps out to players when they are 28/29 - instead of trying them out/bedding them in when they are 24/25.

 

A 28/29 will likely only feature for 1 or 2 campaigns at most.

 

Get the right players in earlier, help them develop international players and then you might have someone who can be part of 3 or 4 campaigns instead. That's how you get a team with 500+ caps on the park.

 

This is basically what Wales did about 8-10 year ago by playing a load of young players and getting them experience. Granted they got pumped quite a bit if I mind correctly but come the last Euros it benefited them didn't it. Not having a Scottish Gareth Bale might make it harder though...

[V for Vendetta]

 

This is basically what Wales did about 8-10 year ago by playing a load of young players and getting them experience. Granted they got pumped quite a bit if I mind correctly but come the last Euros it benefited them didn't it. Not having a Scottish Gareth Bale might make it harder though...

Exactly.

 

It's not black and white for every player clearly but we should plan to give potential some exposure to inter action football a bit quicker.

 

Too often our national managers are safety first, short term.

[strachanmcgheegoal]

(Life's not black and white like a chat forum)

 

 

 

Rascist

[V for Vendetta]

 

Rascist

?

[craegDAMH]

 

This is basically what Wales did about 8-10 year ago by playing a load of young players and getting them experience. Granted they got pumped quite a bit if I mind correctly but come the last Euros it benefited them didn't it. Not having a Scottish Gareth Bale might make it harder though...

 

Wales also used friendly matches intelligently to improve their ranking which helped improve their chances of qualifying.

 

Playing against beatable teams with high rankings or high ranking confederations, and treating the games as competitive must win games, helped their ranking considerably.

[DD1903]

"Pulling me up" - like some kind of blog police? Cool.

 

I don't need to read what I wrote, it's not really that complicated.

 

The answer is: both. (Life's not black and white like a chat forum)

 

I'd have given Archer the benefit of the doubt but having watched it his performance was so bad I don't think we can afford to have him back in too soon. Maybe in time.

But he might be one of these players who needs 10-15 games! It's not black and white after all

[fine-n-dandy]

He's also defensively quite poor as seen in the recent international games he has played.

 

Shame but he needs game time at RB really.

Paterson was always suspect at defending but a powerhouse going forward.

 

He's far more suited further forward.

[V for Vendetta]

But he might be one of these players who needs 10-15 games! It's not black and white after all

It's a judgement call, that's what a good football manager does.

[RAZOR]

Paterson was always suspect at defending but a powerhouse going forward.

 

He's far more suited further forward.

Did he not start out as a striker?

[Ke1t]

 

McKenna walked straight into it and was great. He's something of an exception though and many players do have a settling in period when stepping up a level.

 

Why do you think so much was made of Peru having 500 caps between the starting line up and our team only having 50ish? Is it because all our players can just play international football quality football on their debut or is it because experience is important at international level?

 

My problem with Scotland is we wait too long to give players a chance and too often start handing caps out to players when they are 28/29 - instead of trying them out/bedding them in when they are 24/25.

 

A 28/29 will likely only feature for 1 or 2 campaigns at most.

 

Get the right players in earlier, help them develop international players and then you might have someone who can be part of 3 or 4 campaigns instead. That's how you get a team with 500+ caps on the park.

 

One of the most obvious things to take away from the Peru game was the understanding their players had on the field.

 

I'd mentioned that our players were looking for the obvious pass, while the Paddingtons were looking for clever passes that changed the direction of play or otherwise wrong footed our players. That comes with the experience of regularly playing with a group of players. Our guys looked more like 11 strangers who hadn't played as a team before, which is largely true, while theirs had an understanding of the system they were playing and the position/movement of their team mates.

 

Even if that weren't the case, though, the Peruvians were far more comfortable on the ball even on just an individual basis.

 

They just had far better players than Scotland.

[V for Vendetta]

Agreed Kelt.

 

This is why I want to see a strategy where we get the best players into the full team and squad younger than currently.

 

I'm so fed up watching is give the first cap to a guy at 28 or 29 when that players been playing at a good level for years before.

 

Means they ultimately have shortened in international careers and building a team long term just can't happen.