Nicky Devlin

[elephantstone78]

10 minutes ago, CCB III said:

A true dumb dumb, scarfer cunt. 

Are you just having one of those mornings ccb? 

[CCB III]

53 minutes ago, minijc said:

He hasn't been though, he looked poor on saturday, well more just clueless but that comes down to how we are set up and how the players are unstructured to play.  I don't mind inverted fullbacks but you need to have very skilled players further forward making the right moves, creating space and allowing them to advance up the field.

For me, we don't have the pace in the side, we are far too narrow when trying this and as highlighted by Neil fucking McCann one pass totally eliminates 5 of our players, it happened a lot in the first half away to Hacken as well, it's pure negligence from the manager and coaches to have not addressed that.

 

I disagree, he's been as poor as anyone. Okay, he shows a bit more dig and the management and coaching instruction isn't great, but for me, he's been every bit as bad at the basics as everyone else in the back line.

 

Full backs at our level aren't good enough to go play in midfield and do anything. The guy was a Livi meeler for most his career, with good reason, does the basics well, that can't be said about him at the moment. 
 

Management is a huge issue but I don't think any of the new signings look up to much at all, not to mention the dithering form of Clarkson, Roos, and Duk. 
 

He's a downgrade on McCrorie. Just like McGrath is a downgrade on Ramadani (different roles ideally but same principle applies.) Rubezic isn't as good as Pollock. Shinnie isn't good advanced.

[sooth_stander]

59 minutes ago, minijc said:

He hasn't been though, he looked poor on saturday, well more just clueless but that comes down to how we are set up and how the players are unstructured to play.  I don't mind inverted fullbacks but you need to have very skilled players further forward making the right moves, creating space and allowing them to advance up the field.

For me, we don't have the pace in the side, we are far too narrow when trying this and as highlighted by Neil fucking McCann one pass totally eliminates 5 of our players, it happened a lot in the first half away to Hacken as well, it's pure negligence from the manager and coaches to have not addressed that.

 

Crazy shit. So Robson is telling our wing backs to tuck in narrow, meaning we have absolutely no width whatsoever?

[aberdeen1970]

We need to go back to a back 4. The back 3 worked in the short term last season but it's clearly not working any more. 

Also, if we plan to play through the lines then we need a bit of depth to our midfield as our lines are too far apart.

So rather than 352 we should consider a 4231 or a 4321 or suchlike to enable us to play through the midfield rather than launching it. Would also provide better cover should teams inevitably break the high press from time to time. 

[sooth_stander]

2 minutes ago, aberdeen1970 said:

We need to go back to a back 4. The back 3 worked in the short term last season but it's clearly not working any more. 

Also, if we plan to play through the lines then we need a bit of depth to our midfield as our lines are too far apart.

So rather than 352 we should consider a 4231 or a 4321 or suchlike to enable us to play through the midfield rather than launching it. Would also provide better cover should teams inevitably break the high press from time to time. 

Correct

Shinnie and Barron (probably) holding, Duk, Clarkson and either Hayes or Duncan in the 3, behind Miovski

Devlin, Dane, Fin and NZ in the back 4

[Guest]

1 hour ago, minijc said:

He hasn't been though, he looked poor on saturday, well more just clueless but that comes down to how we are set up and how the players are unstructured to play.  I don't mind inverted fullbacks but you need to have very skilled players further forward making the right moves, creating space and allowing them to advance up the field.

For me, we don't have the pace in the side, we are far too narrow when trying this and as highlighted by Neil fucking McCann one pass totally eliminates 5 of our players, it happened a lot in the first half away to Hacken as well, it's pure negligence from the manager and coaches to have not addressed that.

 

I agree, but Devlin had one hell of a cockup with Roos during the 2nd half and in general, looks slow to get back. I'm not caring what you've asked to do or where to play. If you have more opponents than defenders, you get your arse back and help out. Hence why I compared him to TAA who is a master at plodding back and thinking, ach, it's fine, Konate or Matip will bail me out. Sometimes as a player, you have to take responsibility for yourself and as Robson rightly said (one thing that was true) is that you defend as a team from front to back. He wanted energy and fit players to cope with the inevitable turnover in possession and both Devlin and McGarry were both found wanting at times. 1st half, McGarry was more interested in ball watching than the player to his outside.

Ultimately, if Robson drops this formation balls up and goes to a flat back 4 with a bit more of a solid midfield look to it.... ensuring we retain possession and shore things up, I'm sure the issue will vanish overnight.

                  Roos
Dev - Gart - Jensen - McGarry
               Shinnie
Duncan - McGrath  - Clarkson - Duk
               Miovski

or....

                  Roos
 Gart - Ruby - Angus - Jensen
 Dev -  Shinnie - McGarry
       Clarkson - Duk
           Miovski

2nd option gives you options for players overlapping or being able to replace others if/when we lose the ball.

I dunno.... somewhere, there's an answer to how we change the formtion and line up. He may have to drop some of his new signings from game to game, but then again, I thought that's what the intention of having a stronger/larger squad was always about.

 

[aberdeen1970]

1 minute ago, Tinyweelad said:

I agree, but Devlin had one hell of a cockup with Roos during the 2nd half and in general, looks slow to get back. I'm not caring what you've asked to do or where to play. If you have more opponents than defenders, you get your arse back and help out. Hence why I compared him to TAA who is a master at plodding back and thinking, ach, it's fine, Konate or Matip will bail me out. Sometimes as a player, you have to take responsibility for yourself and as Robson rightly said (one thing that was true) is that you defend as a team from front to back. He wanted energy and fit players to cope with the inevitable turnover in possession and both Devlin and McGarry were both found wanting at times. 1st half, McGarry was more interested in ball watching than the player to his outside.

Ultimately, if Robson drops this formation balls up and goes to a flat back 4 with a bit more of a solid midfield look to it.... ensuring we retain possession and shore things up, I'm sure the issue will vanish overnight.

                  Roos
Dev - Gart - Jensen - McGarry
               Shinnie
  McGrath  -  Clarkson - Duk
               Miovski

or....

                  Roos
 Gart - Ruby - Angus - Jensen
       Dev -  Shinnie - McGarry
   McGrath - Clarkson - Duk
                 Miovski

2nd option gives you options for players overlapping or being able to replace others if/when we lose the ball.

I dunno.... somewhere, there's an asnwer to how we change the formtion and line up. He may have to drop some of his new signings from game to game, but then again, I thought that's what the intention of having a stronger/larger squad was always about.

 

Your first selection has 10 players in it and your second selection has 12

[perthshirered]

16 minutes ago, CCB III said:

I disagree, he's been as poor as anyone. Okay, he shows a bit more dig and the management and coaching instruction isn't great, but for me, he's been every bit as bad at the basics as everyone else in the back line.

 

Full backs at our level aren't good enough to go play in midfield and do anything. The guy was a Livi meeler for most his career, with good reason, does the basics well, that can't be said about him at the moment. 
 

Management is a huge issue but I don't think any of the new signings look up to much at all, not to mention the dithering form of Clarkson, Roos, and Duk. 
 

He's a downgrade on McCrorie. Just like McGrath is a downgrade on Ramadani (different roles ideally but same principle applies.) Rubezic isn't as good as Pollock. Shinnie isn't good advanced.

If, as you say, full backs at our level aren't good enough to play in midfield, then why are you slagging off a full back at our level that's being asked to push on into the midfield? That's 100% down to the tit on the sideline. 

[aberdeen1970]

5 minutes ago, sooth_stander said:

Correct

Shinnie and Barron (probably) holding, Duk, Clarkson and either Hayes or Duncan in the 3, behind Miovski

Devlin, Dane, Fin and NZ in the back 4

Aye Shinnie and Barron for me in the deeper midfield line. 

Duk, Clarkson and McGrath further up. 

[wullfo]

8 minutes ago, Tinyweelad said:

I agree, but Devlin had one hell of a cockup with Roos during the 2nd half and in general, looks slow to get back. I'm not caring what you've asked to do or where to play. If you have more opponents than defenders, you get your arse back and help out. Hence why I compared him to TAA who is a master at plodding back and thinking, ach, it's fine, Konate or Matip will bail me out. Sometimes as a player, you have to take responsibility for yourself and as Robson rightly said (one thing that was true) is that you defend as a team from front to back. He wanted energy and fit players to cope with the inevitable turnover in possession and both Devlin and McGarry were both found wanting at times. 1st half, McGarry was more interested in ball watching than the player to his outside.

Ultimately, if Robson drops this formation balls up and goes to a flat back 4 with a bit more of a solid midfield look to it.... ensuring we retain possession and shore things up, I'm sure the issue will vanish overnight.

                  Roos
Dev - Gart - Jensen - McGarry
               Shinnie
  McGrath  -  Clarkson - Duk
               Miovski

or....

                  Roos
 Gart - Ruby - Angus - Jensen
       Dev -  Shinnie - McGarry
   McGrath - Clarkson - Duk
                 Miovski

2nd option gives you options for players overlapping or being able to replace others if/when we lose the ball.

I dunno.... somewhere, there's an asnwer to how we change the formtion and line up. He may have to drop some of his new signings from game to game, but then again, I thought that's what the intention of having a stronger/larger squad was always about.

 

Id go with option 2, 12 players are always better than 10 in option 1 

[minijc]

9 minutes ago, CCB III said:

I disagree, he's been as poor as anyone. Okay, he shows a bit more dig and the management and coaching instruction isn't great, but for me, he's been every bit as bad at the basics as everyone else in the back line.

 

Full backs at our level aren't good enough to go play in midfield and do anything. The guy was a Livi meeler for most his career, with good reason, does the basics well, that can't be said about him at the moment. 
 

Management is a huge issue but I don't think any of the new signings look up to much at all, not to mention the dithering form of Clarkson, Roos, and Duk. 
 

He's a downgrade on McCrorie. Just like McGrath is a downgrade on Ramadani (different roles ideally but same principle applies.) Rubezic isn't as good as Pollock. Shinnie isn't good advanced.

Think there's a real arrogance with some of our fans and how they look at players from lesser teams up here and it shows in your post.  You're comparing Devlin who has had 7 competitive games for us with a guy who played 115 times for us and I don't think that's fair right now, especially when our set up is terrible and we are nullifying a lot of our own players in the process.

I agree that McGrath is a downgrade on Ramadani but as you say, different roles, totally different players in fact.  Clarkson looks poor because our plan is obvious as fuck, we've taken the attacking threat away from him and basically trying to use him as a DM and for lack of a better term a quarterback to start attacks.

5 minutes ago, sooth_stander said:

Crazy shit. So Robson is telling our wing backs to tuck in narrow, meaning we have absolutely no width whatsoever?

It looks that given how narrow we've been playing and the average positions of the wingbacks, think Robson has seen what pep and and Ange do and tried to implement it to look like a genius but sadly he just looks like a fucking idiot.

[minijc]

14 minutes ago, Tinyweelad said:

I agree, but Devlin had one hell of a cockup with Roos during the 2nd half and in general, looks slow to get back. I'm not caring what you've asked to do or where to play. If you have more opponents than defenders, you get your arse back and help out. Hence why I compared him to TAA who is a master at plodding back and thinking, ach, it's fine, Konate or Matip will bail me out. Sometimes as a player, you have to take responsibility for yourself and as Robson rightly said (one thing that was true) is that you defend as a team from front to back. He wanted energy and fit players to cope with the inevitable turnover in possession and both Devlin and McGarry were both found wanting at times. 1st half, McGarry was more interested in ball watching than the player to his outside.

Ultimately, if Robson drops this formation balls up and goes to a flat back 4 with a bit more of a solid midfield look to it.... ensuring we retain possession and shore things up, I'm sure the issue will vanish overnight.

                  Roos
Dev - Gart - Jensen - McGarry
               Shinnie
  McGrath  -  Clarkson - Duk
               Miovski

or....

                  Roos
 Gart - Ruby - Angus - Jensen
       Dev -  Shinnie - McGarry
   McGrath - Clarkson - Duk
                 Miovski

2nd option gives you options for players overlapping or being able to replace others if/when we lose the ball.

I dunno.... somewhere, there's an answer to how we change the formtion and line up. He may have to drop some of his new signings from game to game, but then again, I thought that's what the intention of having a stronger/larger squad was always about.

 

Can you not see that by having the wingbacks inverted, the second we lose the ball, especially in an advanced position, it takes one good pass to eliminate them and the midfield?  Doesn't matter how hard the players try to get back, this comes down to the tactics and what is being coached during the week, or in our case what isn't being coached but trust in Robbo, he's got his coaching badges (lol) we're just fans.

[Guest]

17 minutes ago, aberdeen1970 said:

Your first selection has 10 players in it and your second selection has 12

9 minutes ago, wullfo said:

Id go with option 2, 12 players are always better than 10 in option 1 

Haha... fuck me, made a hash of that. Fixed it noo.... see how hard managerial shit is

[Guest]

8 minutes ago, minijc said:

Can you not see that by having the wingbacks inverted, the second we lose the ball, especially in an advanced position, it takes one good pass to eliminate them and the midfield?  Doesn't matter how hard the players try to get back, this comes down to the tactics and what is being coached during the week, or in our case what isn't being coached but trust in Robbo, he's got his coaching badges (lol) we're just fans.

Has he employed the inverted part of it though or is that maybe McGarry and Devlin getting drawn into the middle through our inability to hold on to the ball? I didn't see Morris playing that role so why would it have changed in the last 2 games?

[minijc]

1 minute ago, Tinyweelad said:

Has he amployed the inverted part of it though or is that maybe McGarry and Devlin getting drawn into the middle through our inability to hold on to the ball? I didn't see Morris playing that role so why would it have changed in the last 2 games?

I replied to you last night showing two exampled of how narrow we were playing, even with Morris playing, you're choosing to ignore it.

[sooth_stander]

What the above does further illustrate and enforce is the lack of central midfielders; the fact that we have Barron and/or Polvara in the conversation tells you this.

As a last throw of the dice, reckon DC will throw Robson an out of contract player?

[Guest]

4 minutes ago, minijc said:

I replied to you last night showing two exampled of how narrow we were playing, even with Morris playing, you're choosing to ignore it.

Where? I've no heat maps or whatever, only my own eyes, but by and large, Morris had, since the start of the season, been hogging that right side of the pitch. It was so evdident during Hacken, the massive gap that was left between where he was playing and Devlin.
Either way - we're both in agreement that it's not working - the wing back experiment. So he changes it or it'll be his death knell.

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, sooth_stander said:

What the above does further illustrate and enforce is the lack of central midfielders; the fact that we have Barron and/or Polvara in the conversation tells you this.

As a last throw of the dice, reckon DC will throw Robson an out of contract player?

They hinted at that after the window shut didn't they? Surely to god someone is sat out of contract who could shore up the midfield. Even an ageing attack minded midfielder who doesn't have the legs now, but could drop back a wee bit (bit like Gerrard did when he lost his pace).

[minijc]

8 minutes ago, Tinyweelad said:

Where? I've no heat maps or whatever, only my own eyes, but by and large, Morris had, since the start of the season, been hogging that right side of the pitch. It was so evdident during Hacken, the massive gap that was left between where he was playing and Devlin.
Either way - we're both in agreement that it's not working - the wing back experiment. So he changes it or it'll be his death knell.

Post in the Hearts match thread, last page.

[Guest]

6 minutes ago, minijc said:

Post in the Hearts match thread, last page.

I wouldn't particularly say that is narrow. Sure, it's not on the touch line, but there's times when he'll need to come in field to close down the opponent. Upon attacking though, not very often it must be said, he usually likes to stay tight to the line.
Devlin, I'll give you that.... almost like a right sided CM for the majority.

[minijc]

1 minute ago, Tinyweelad said:

I wouldn't particularly say that is narrow. Sure, it's not on the touch line, but there's times when he'll need to come in field to close down the opponent. Upon attacking though, not very often it must be said, he usually likes to stay tight to the line.
Devlin, I'll give you that.... almost like a right sided CM for the majority.

Come on, it's a bigger picture thing, if Morris isn't too narrow that's fine but the left sided one is where as on saturday both were inverted and that was problematic.  Against Livi we were very narrow to my eye and the average positions show that too.

[Matt Armstrong's Dog]

3 hours ago, CCB III said:

Did well on a plastic pitch playing a very specific style. 
 

Best game he's had for us is probably Livi away, which says a lot. Took his goal in Hacken really well but other than that been found massively wanting. 
 

 

Nicky Devlin isn't even an issue never mind the least of our worries.

He has proven at AFC as well as before at Livingston he is a very capable RB as part of a flat back 4, with a licence to bomb up and down the right wing.

He fucked up against the tims (second goal) but he never hid thereafter and his clearance off our goal line at the paddock end in the second half was outstanding in terms of anticipation, positional sense, and taking ownership of the defensive side of the situation.

Don't quite get your beef with Devlin but we're all different. 

Out of curiosity, are you going through the change, CCB min?🤔

[BaaBaaRedSheep]

37 minutes ago, Tinyweelad said:

Haha... fuck me, made a hash of that. Fixed it noo.... see how hard managerial shit is

Barry, get off the hat and get back to the training ground running drills?

[Guest]

10 minutes ago, minijc said:

Come on, it's a bigger picture thing, if Morris isn't too narrow that's fine but the left sided one is where as on saturday both were inverted and that was problematic.  Against Livi we were very narrow to my eye and the average positions show that too.

I have a feeling, as a player, if you're being asked to play as a wing back, but see thier midfield overunning yours and a player has the ball and you know Shinnie or Polvara are being compromised, you'll try and adjust to that situation and help out. That's the reason I see for the narrow aspect. I can't imagine for a second the tactic is to leave that gapiing hole down the channels that every opponent manager has seen as our achilles heal.

Post match on Sportscene, they suggested maybe the players not getting what's being asked of them. Or maybe it is what's being asked of them. The coming games will tell us for sure, as I can't believe the coaching staff haven't established that's where our main problem lies right now. Secondary to that, the lack of fight in midfield.

[minijc]

2 minutes ago, Tinyweelad said:

I have a feeling, as a player, if you're being asked to play as a wing back, but see thier midfield overunning yours and a player has the ball and you know Shinnie or Polvara are being compromised, you'll try and adjust to that situation and help out. That's the reason I see for the narrow aspect. I can't imagine for a second the tactic is to leave that gapiing hole down the channels that every opponent manager has seen as our achilles heal.

Post match on Sportscene, they suggested maybe the players not getting what's being asked of them. Or maybe it is what's being asked of them. The coming games will tell us for sure, as I can't believe the coaching staff haven't established that's where our maiin problem lies right now. Secondary to that, the lack of fight in midfield.

I don't think that is the case, it looks like it's designed, if you look at what Roos does with the ball there is no need for players to be wide even though there should be, it's clear that we go route 1 and hope for a bit of luck. 

The sportscene clips showed what we are doing, again I don't mind inverted wingbacks or fullbacks but it's not an easy thing to implement and we don't have the players for it.

[Joe pike]

20 minutes ago, minijc said:

I don't think that is the case, it looks like it's designed, if you look at what Roos does with the ball there is no need for players to be wide even though there should be, it's clear that we go route 1 and hope for a bit of luck. 

The sportscene clips showed what we are doing, again I don't mind inverted wingbacks or fullbacks but it's not an easy thing to implement and we don't have the players for it.

Asking for a friend.

What’s inverted wingbacks ?

[Matt Armstrong's Dog]

5 minutes ago, Joe pike said:

Asking for a friend.

What’s inverted wingbacks ?

The modern version of an inside left or an inside right?🤔😄

[minijc]

2 minutes ago, Joe pike said:

Asking for a friend.

What’s inverted wingbacks ?

Where they come inside centrally to basically form a part of the midfield

[Don_Corleone]

The Sportscene clips were embarrassing.

We've got players who can actually keep and pass the ball so not sure why Robson thinks it's wise to lump it forward first time every time. It makes no sense. It's not using our best players to best effect. Duk and Miovski are hardly in the games and are just chasing lost causes most of the time. No wonder they're frustrated and lacking confidence. Clarkson is being told to play the ball over the top every time it comes to him - yes he's a great passer with great vision but this is not the best way to utilise him, and you can see that he's getting frustrated too. Shinnie is having to bomb up and down the park constantly chasing the ball and he clearly doesn't have the energy for it anymore. Setting ourselves up to fail.

 

[Snelders Snottters 89]

15 minutes ago, Don_Corleone said:

The Sportscene clips were embarrassing.

We've got players who can actually keep and pass the ball so not sure why Robson thinks it's wise to lump it forward first time every time. It makes no sense. It's not using our best players to best effect. Duk and Miovski are hardly in the games and are just chasing lost causes most of the time. No wonder they're frustrated and lacking confidence. Clarkson is being told to play the ball over the top every time it comes to him - yes he's a great passer with great vision but this is not the best way to utilise him, and you can see that he's getting frustrated too. Shinnie is having to bomb up and down the park constantly chasing the ball and he clearly doesn't have the energy for it anymore. Setting ourselves up to fail.

 

See Clarkson's ball to miovski v huns' he was close to the box on the left side. But mongo man robbo thinks he is better doing it from inside his own half all the time. Makes me wonder if he is just utterly thick & brainless.