Addicts

[tutankamun]

I'm addicted to derailing threads I'm afraid, dinna be hard on me for it, it's a disease and these off topic posts are a cry for help.

 

I don't think you're addicted to it, however you are obsessed with it.

 

We (The Mods) may have to make an 'intervention' of some kind before it gets out of control.

 

Don't worry, it's for your own good.

[tup]

I don't think you're addicted to it, however you are obsessed with it.

 

We (The Mods) may have to make an 'intervention' of some kind before it gets out of control.

 

Don't worry, it's for your own good.

 

I admit to an illness and I get scorn and veiled threats, I'm the (figurative) nut, you're the (literal) sledgehammer.

 

Dressed up as cruel to be kind, like the man throwing a bag of kittens into a fast river weighed down with a brick, you feel you're doing the right thing.

 

I'm the kitten in all this, my only crime being to exist.

 

I'm kidding, it's as you were, addictions.

 

Did you know that Cillit Bang is the 4th most abused drug in the US of A?

[spamspamspam]

I don't think so because I think it sends out the wrong message to kids for a start. Look what happened when cannabis was reclassified. There was an explosion in its production around the country. I'm sure there are plenty of folk on here who wouldn't see that as a problem but it does cause mental health problems and nobody ever mentions the fact that it is smoked with tobacco without a filter and is way more cancerous than smoking a normal cigarette.

 

Where do you stop with legalisation, do we legalise Crack and Crystal Meth? There is no way in hell that is the answer.

 

A combination of huge investment in treatment and much much longer sentences for drug dealers is the way I would go.

 

The growth in growing in the UK had more to do with the Moroc government burning plantations after pressure from the European governments than the reclassification of cannabis from B to C, in a way the UK government was responsible for the growth. It was still illegal, there is little difference in sentencing for intent to supply a C and a B. All the reclassification did was move it to a more realistic level in comparison the the other drugs in the tables. It can cause problems to some, so can drinking moderately, asprin, too much steak. Its up to each person to weigh up their risks and decide for themselves just like they do when they drink, smoke, eat 4 butteries every morning...

 

As long as alcohol and cigarettes are legal them other drugs have to be measured against those to insure a fair system. We could go into why drugs are now illegal whereas they were socially acceptable up until around the 30's but we are where we are. So the system isnt fair when measured against cigarettes or alcohol but it has to be when the drugs are measured against each other. Cannabinol, found in a lot of grass was a class a before the first reclassification. Now they are both b, same as meth and same as speed... that cant be right can it?

 

Laws are in place to protect society from others. Now I understand that arguments can be made that grass money can fund other less savory criminal pass times but what harm is someone doing growing a couple of plants and feeding themselves, for example? If a more sensible approach was taken to drugs in general then people would also take a more sensible approach. I know lots of Dutch people who have never smoked a joint and only took mushrooms 18 months ago just before they were made illegal. They took them because they said they always thought they could if the wanted to but didnt... This comes from a better understanding which comes from a more relaxed attitude and better education because of the relaxed attitudes to drugs and discussing drugs. I'm not saying its perfect, far from it but their drug problems are nowhere near as bad as ours.

 

I'm for full legalisation of drugs but with serious controls on their sales and managed properly. That way the criminal element is almost eliminated, addicts treatment can be paid for by taxes raised and a lot of the countries debt could be wiped out as well. Man was taking drugs before he was crossing seas and will be long after we leave this earth. Instead of spending billions fighting it the government should take control of it, its the only way the whole issue will ever be sorted out and they could make a sh*t load of money along the way.

[dervish]

Suppose really it's the social effects of these addictions that are the problem, if we could have a pipe of opium before work rather than a starbucks and not harm anyone else it'd be ok. The majority of addicts I'd assume are just guided by an "invisible hand" to a predictable outcome. sh*t life, sh*t prospects possibly a chemical predisposition and all of a sudden it's inevitable.

 

EDIT: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_Opium_War < how we got Hong Kong fighting for our drugs.

[HughMungus]

The growth in growing in the UK had more to do with the Moroc government burning plantations after pressure from the European governments than the reclassification of cannabis from B to C, in a way the UK government was responsible for the growth. It was still illegal, there is little difference in sentencing for intent to supply a C and a B. All the reclassification did was move it to a more realistic level in comparison the the other drugs in the tables. It can cause problems to some, so can drinking moderately, asprin, too much steak. Its up to each person to weigh up their risks and decide for themselves just like they do when they drink, smoke, eat 4 butteries every morning...

 

As long as alcohol and cigarettes are legal them other drugs have to be measured against those to insure a fair system. We could go into why drugs are now illegal whereas they were socially acceptable up until around the 30's but we are where we are. So the system isnt fair when measured against cigarettes or alcohol but it has to be when the drugs are measured against each other. Cannabinol, found in a lot of grass was a class a before the first reclassification. Now they are both b, same as meth and same as speed... that cant be right can it?

 

Laws are in place to protect society from others. Now I understand that arguments can be made that grass money can fund other less savory criminal pass times but what harm is someone doing growing a couple of plants and feeding themselves, for example? If a more sensible approach was taken to drugs in general then people would also take a more sensible approach. I know lots of Dutch people who have never smoked a joint and only took mushrooms 18 months ago just before they were made illegal. They took them because they said they always thought they could if the wanted to but didnt... This comes from a better understanding which comes from a more relaxed attitude and better education because of the relaxed attitudes to drugs and discussing drugs. I'm not saying its perfect, far from it but their drug problems are nowhere near as bad as ours.

 

I'm for full legalisation of drugs but with serious controls on their sales and managed properly. That way the criminal element is almost eliminated, addicts treatment can be paid for by taxes raised and a lot of the countries debt could be wiped out as well. Man was taking drugs before he was crossing seas and will be long after we leave this earth. Instead of spending billions fighting it the government should take control of it, its the only way the whole issue will ever be sorted out and they could make a sh*t load of money along the way.

 

totally and utterly agree with spamspamspam there..(you wern't in Marti pellow's band were you?) poor joke I know..

[muttondressedaslamb]

Excellent points spam. Totally agree with you. Unfortunately the government won't listen to their doctors who repeatedly advocate reform (then get sacked).

[Quagmire]

I recommend reading Scar Tissue by Anthony Kiedis for a good old tale of a junkie in the spotlight. Its an amazing read and a wonder the duys still alive.

[HughMungus]

totally and utterly agree with spamspamspam there..(you wern't in Marti pellow's band were you?) poor joke I know..

 

 

 

"Instead of spending billions fighting it the government should take control of it, its the only way the whole issue will ever be sorted out and they could make a sh*t load of money along the way."

 

so gled I'm not alone..

 

It's a mixture of hilarity and tragedy that folkies don't get the joke about substances being "controlled"

 

controlled my phukkin erse...devolved to the mafia...aye!

 

sh*t!

 

I've just been caught out spikkin sheyite to yoooz by mine....byeeeee

[Red Viking]

Surely it could be applied to anything then if that's how you get addicted to things, by 'havving enough of it'.

 

Have enough Tomato soup and you get addicted?

Have enough choclate and you get addicted?

 

Certain people get addicted perhaps but to generalise that as a rule for everyone is crazy. You'll get people who take heroin but aren't addicted. It's all about an idividual.

 

I'm pretty sure I've went out on nights out drank a ridiculous amount of alcohol and not got addicted.

I agree,its all about the the person.Some can take it and leave it some cant.

[barassie_afc]

Didnt see this being trawled out when people were napalming the "junkie" f**kers on the Scheme. Winehouse and her lot make a choice, like millions did(including me) in the late 80s and early 90's (disco biscuits) we all wanted a great high/hit, she just wanted more and more , heroin, crack, alcohol, disease....? Pish, just lack of self control and availabilty. When did her addiction start, pre or post fame.....answers on a Rizla......... (seemingly her granny died)

 

Brand is an attention seeking talentless fukoid for what is worth

[Monkey]

I admit to an illness and I get scorn and veiled threats, I'm the (figurative) nut, you're the (literal) sledgehammer.

 

Dressed up as cruel to be kind, like the man throwing a bag of kittens into a fast river weighed down with a brick, you feel you're doing the right thing.

 

I'm the kitten in all this, my only crime being to exist.

 

I'm kidding, it's as you were, addictions.

 

Did you know that Cillit Bang is the 4th most abused drug in the US of A?

 

Really?!?

 

I'm interested in this claim, Source?

[The Boofon]

Really?!?

 

I'm interested in this claim, Source?

 

Bang addicts

 

 

He's taking the piss though as it's called Easy-off BAM in the states.

 

 

[spamspamspam]

Really?!?

 

I'm interested in this claim, Source?

 

He isnt taking the piss, things like Cillit Bang are used to make GHB.

 

Its made from paint stripper for wood furniture (GBL), purified drain cleaner (cillit bang, drain doctor and red devil being the popular ones) and then mixing it with potassium hydroxide.

 

Sounds amazing, eh? On a serious note though it does show the lengths man will go to to get high. If it was controlled by governments drugs would be a lot safer, people wouldnt be cooking this sh*t up in there kitchen for starters.

[Bluto10]

legalise the lot.

 

add a whole load of tax onto it.

 

reduce the duty on booze.

 

blutos a happy man.

[Pudgie]

legalise the lot.

 

add a whole load of tax onto it.

 

reduce the duty on booze.

 

blutos a happy man.

Seems straight forward enough. Come on Dave, make it happen (I'm assuming Mr Cameron is a dandy...).

[fifered]

The growth in growing in the UK had more to do with the Moroc government burning plantations after pressure from the European governments than the reclassification of cannabis from B to C, in a way the UK government was responsible for the growth. It was still illegal, there is little difference in sentencing for intent to supply a C and a B. All the reclassification did was move it to a more realistic level in comparison the the other drugs in the tables. It can cause problems to some, so can drinking moderately, asprin, too much steak. Its up to each person to weigh up their risks and decide for themselves just like they do when they drink, smoke, eat 4 butteries every morning...

 

As long as alcohol and cigarettes are legal them other drugs have to be measured against those to insure a fair system. We could go into why drugs are now illegal whereas they were socially acceptable up until around the 30's but we are where we are. So the system isnt fair when measured against cigarettes or alcohol but it has to be when the drugs are measured against each other. Cannabinol, found in a lot of grass was a class a before the first reclassification. Now they are both b, same as meth and same as speed... that cant be right can it?

 

Laws are in place to protect society from others. Now I understand that arguments can be made that grass money can fund other less savory criminal pass times but what harm is someone doing growing a couple of plants and feeding themselves, for example? If a more sensible approach was taken to drugs in general then people would also take a more sensible approach. I know lots of Dutch people who have never smoked a joint and only took mushrooms 18 months ago just before they were made illegal. They took them because they said they always thought they could if the wanted to but didnt... This comes from a better understanding which comes from a more relaxed attitude and better education because of the relaxed attitudes to drugs and discussing drugs. I'm not saying its perfect, far from it but their drug problems are nowhere near as bad as ours.

 

I'm for full legalisation of drugs but with serious controls on their sales and managed properly. That way the criminal element is almost eliminated, addicts treatment can be paid for by taxes raised and a lot of the countries debt could be wiped out as well. Man was taking drugs before he was crossing seas and will be long after we leave this earth. Instead of spending billions fighting it the government should take control of it, its the only way the whole issue will ever be sorted out and they could make a sh*t load of money along the way.

the huge rise in cannabis production was fueled by the influx of Chinese and Vietnamese crime gangs who identified the UK as a good place to grow due to more lax laws.

 

aside from that, saying all drugs should be legalized is way to simplistic. heroin on prescription i understand due to its physically addictive nature but crack, crystal meth, coke, gbh, mdpv, mdma etc etc. no chance. if it were done through the nhs it'd go bankrupt! who would decide how much crack you're allowed a day? or do we just set up shops selling crystal meth on every high street? if the nhs give some boy coke and then he has a heart attack who is at fault? for so many reasons its a nonsense. as i already said, longer sentences for dealers and a massive increase in treatment is a more balanced way forward in my opinion.

 

you cannot treat the arguments about the legalization of all drugs as one because they are all different.

[Bluto10]

Seems straight forward enough. Come on Dave, make it happen (I'm assuming Mr Cameron is a dandy...).

 

in seriosity though.

 

the dutch gov like to be liberal n all when they are actually the complete opposite and control everything.

 

surely its a no brainer that drug money should go to the gov rather than local hoodelums.

 

 

wonder why more countries havent taken the dutch approach?

[Nelly]

legalise the lot.

 

add a whole load of tax onto it.

 

reduce the duty on booze.

 

blutos a happy man.

 

But then the amount of tax soon makes it unaffordable to the average junkie, creating a black market for cheaper poorer quality drugs, plus new mind-blowing synthetic drugs and we're back to square one.

[barassie_afc]

But then the amount of tax soon makes it unaffordable to the average junkie, creating a black market for cheaper poorer quality drugs, plus new mind-blowing synthetic drugs and we're back to square one.

 

Where can I get em ?

[fifered]

But then the amount of tax soon makes it unaffordable to the average junkie, creating a black market for cheaper poorer quality drugs, plus new mind-blowing synthetic drugs and we're back to square one.

exactly. just like what is happening with cigarettes.

[Bluto10]

But then the amount of tax soon makes it unaffordable to the average junkie, creating a black market for cheaper poorer quality drugs, plus new mind-blowing synthetic drugs and we're back to square one.

 

well the cafes in holland are usually pretty busy from what i can see.

 

ah f*cuk it. just boil the lot of the junkie scum minks.

[StandFree1982]

alkies have even been known to drink that 100% Germ Killer hand wash stuff in hospitals etc because it contains alcohol!

 

Very sad state of affairs when it reaches that stage!

[Nelly]

well the cafes in holland are usually pretty busy from what i can see.

 

ah f*cuk it. just boil the lot of the junkie scum minks.

 

I'm not against legalising cannabis, just against legalising all drugs

[spamspamspam]

the huge rise in cannabis production was fueled by the influx of Chinese and Vietnamese crime gangs who identified the UK as a good place to grow due to more lax laws.

 

aside from that, saying all drugs should be legalized is way to simplistic. heroin on prescription i understand due to its physically addictive nature but crack, crystal meth, coke, gbh, mdpv, mdma etc etc. no chance. if it were done through the nhs it'd go bankrupt! who would decide how much crack you're allowed a day? or do we just set up shops selling crystal meth on every high street? if the nhs give some boy coke and then he has a heart attack who is at fault? for so many reasons its a nonsense. as i already said, longer sentences for dealers and a massive increase in treatment is a more balanced way forward in my opinion.

 

you cannot treat the arguments about the legalization of all drugs as one because they are all different.

 

Government reports all over Europe disagree with your statement. The triads were here long before they started selling grass, like every organised criminal element they spotted an opportunity and grabbed it. Now that money, handed to them by our government goes towards people smuggling and prostitution. This opportunity was handed to them on a plate, if the demand wasnt there then they wouldnt have the opportunity to supply. The demand was created by our own governments pressure on Morocco to burn their farmers fields. Before that there was a steady supply of solid coming into the UK from Morocco through Spain...

 

Experts would decide how much of any substance would be allowed on a daily/weekly/monthly basis. The NHS wouldnt be the new dealer, bar type establishments that are licensed and have strict guidelines along with a country wide database that all sales go into would help control the sales. If something is available, it can be discussed in an adult manner instead of the just say no sh*te we still hear today. Adult discussions would lead to a better understanding of the risks and a better educated teen is less likely to go chasing the dragon if they know and fully understand all the positives as well as the negatives, especially when a lot of the negatives are over exaggerated and over hyped while the fact they make you feel good and for a lot can be taken with none or little consequences is ignored. If you only push the bad in something and them someone finds that its actually more balanced the whole argument falls apart. It didnt work for Nancy, it failed miserably in the 80's, 90's and is still failing today. Yes there would still be issues but these issues would be controlled in the same way. Its human nature to try to escape, expand the mind, enjoy an altered state of consciousness. Why governments think they can control this after decades of failure beggars belief.

 

I liked your post though, saved me reading the daily mail

[tup]

I would give free heroin to all registered addicts, as much as their veins could handle, constantly, no limits.

 

They're bound to kill themselves rapidly.

 

Therefore eradicating the problem.

 

Crime would also disappear as the fix would be paid for.

 

Everyone's a winner, none more so than Jeremy Kyle, who's ratings would go into the straosphere.

[spamspamspam]

But then the amount of tax soon makes it unaffordable to the average junkie, creating a black market for cheaper poorer quality drugs, plus new mind-blowing synthetic drugs and we're back to square one.

 

no it doesnt

 

 

a gram of good grass in Holland is 6-7 Euro. A gram of cheap sh*t grass in Holland is about 4 euro and usually gives you a sore head or no stone. The 4 Euro stuff isnt worth smoking. If you cant afford 7 Euros then you dont smoke...

 

The profit in cocaine for example from leaving the plantation to arriving in the UK is crazy. You also have the cutting that happens all along the way. By the time it reached Aberdeen it has probably passed through 2 or 3 major dealers and another 2 or 3 minor dealers. Each has a profit to make, each almost double the price. If the government bought direct it would create a new Fair Trade market and the cost of drugs would go down.

[Bluto10]

I would give free heroin to all registered addicts, as much as their veins could handle, constantly, no limits.

 

They're bound to kill themselves rapidly.

 

Therefore eradicating the problem.

 

Crime would also disappear as the fix would be paid for.

 

Everyone's a winner, none more so than Jeremy Kyle, who's ratings would go into the straosphere.

 

 

i like your thinking tup.

 

would like to see maybe a minimal tax on it so the good honest tax paying citizen could benefit even more.

[tup]

The problem we have is that all these pathetic, sharp faced junkies are an industry within themselves.

 

Doctors, social workers, lawyers, court officials, journalists, security guards in shops etc etc etc.

 

All rely on these fiends to keep their pensions topped up.

 

Therefore, contrary to their proclamations, they dinna want rid of them.

[Nelly]

no it doesn't

 

The profit in cocaine for example from leaving the plantation to arriving in the UK is crazy. You also have the cutting that happens all along the way. By the time it reached Aberdeen it has probably passed through 2 or 3 major dealers and another 2 or 3 minor dealers. Each has a profit to make, each almost double the price. If the government bought direct it would create a new Fair Trade market and the cost of drugs would go down.

 

But how long before the goverment starts heaping the tax on? That's what's creating the black market for cigs & alcohol.

[spamspamspam]

But how long before the goverment starts heaping the tax on? That's what's creating the black market for cigs & alcohol.

 

That has more to do with the way we let them off with raising taxes on cigs and alcohol than anything else. The French, pains in the arses they are have the right idea sometimes. Government raises tax to much, French go on strike for a week, country grinds to halt and the government gets no income tax.

 

A lot of the problems this country has were caused by our governments, past and present trying to tell us they know best in the first place. If they did, in general we'd be living in a much better society now than we are.