"hillsborough Files To Be Released"

[Redmist1903]

Aswell as the families asking to see their loved ones and the police saying 'they belong to the coroner now'.

 

No shame.

 

 

To be fair the police were probably just trying to protect the deceased from getting their pockets dipped by opportunistic scouse thief's.

[tommo1903]

I wonder how many of the "outraged" have sung songs about the Ibrox disaster in the past?

[Karl Fletcher]

I don't particularly agree with your last paragraph, Rocket min, but the rest of your last post is fairly spot on.

 

The basic facts, as I know them, is that an enourmous group of fans were led down a tunnel and into a pen that they never should have been. These fans were not to know what was about to happen, you take it for granted that you are going to be safe.

 

Simple as that, really.

 

Aye, there was pushing and shoving and congested pens at fitba in those days but it happened all over the country, hundreds of times a season and nothing like this had ever happened.

 

The blame lies squarely at the blame of the Police who were on duty that day.

 

They panicked.

 

They didn't know how to deal with it.

 

And then they lied.

 

IMO.

[Stoney]

Fail to see what relevence this has to this new report?

[Karl Fletcher]

Remember Karl, as you lick the deep wounds that offend your sensibilities so much, many of the posts that offended you so were made before the facts were made known by the publication of the inquiry yesterday. None of us were privy to what conclusions were made and none of us could have imagined a cover-up on such a shocking scale.

 

Aye, that's fair enough min, I wasn't aware.

 

And I'm nae offended min, things that people write on the Internet have zero bearing on my life, would take a lot to offend me

 

I'm just giving my opinion on it,

[Redmist1903]

Fuck me. 5 minutes is all it took for my words to be overturned. Is this an attempt at humour? Jeezuz wept.

 

 

Humour? No.

 

I'd imagine the police had enough going on at the time without trying to confirm that folk were actually related to some un-identified corpses in a secure area. I'd imagine they were flat out (edit: the police, nae the corpses) and had to prioritise what needed done. Letting dead bodies be seen by their relations probably wouldn't have been a massive priority at the time and might have been considered a waste of resourses, however unkind that sounds. They were probably focusing more on the trapped injured alive folk and trying to clear the stand at the time.

[tup]

And I'm nae offended min, things that people write on the Internet have zero bearing on my life, would take a lot to offend me

 

I'd just like to point out that you're a prick, I've never liked you, and I suspect you're so nice because you're hiding something seriously dodgy in your private life, such as a hoard of child porn, or dead bodies in your back garden.

 

It's the quiet ones you need to keep an eye on they say, never a truer word spoken.

[K-9]

The biggest flaw in your argument, overall, is your claim that many ticketless fans got in. There is no evidence in a 400,000 report of this but it's a line your sticking with?

The footage from outside on news channels last night showed loads of fans getting "hifty" over the wall that day and it wasn't just one or two. Blame is one thing but contributory factor most certainly it would have been. Those over wall and those who went through exit gates not counted in the official statement which says the official no of fans in that end was under capacity.

 

Edit: personally if I had been part of those who jumped wall I would certainly find it hard to not be majorly guilty at the deaths.

[Karl Fletcher]

I'd just like to point out that you're a prick, I've never liked you, and I suspect you're so nice because you're hiding something seriously dodgy in your private life, such as a hoard of child porn, or dead bodies in your back garden.

 

It's the quiet ones you need to keep an eye on they say, never a truer word spoken.

 

FFS

 

Tup, I know I'm one of your faves on here, you can't hide it.

[tup]

FFS

 

Tup, I know I'm one of your faves on here, you can't hide it.

 

You're supposed to be at least mock offended.

[tommo1903]

Karl Fletcher wasn't as good as Ryan Naysmith.

 

Thats bound to offend.

[boboisared]

Karl Fletcher wasn't as good as Ryan Naysmith.

 

Thats bound to offend.

Monday Bandele > Karl Fletcher.

[Tommy]

Don Barker > Karl Fletcher.

[Henry]

Aye, and the new report shows they did a grand job of doing what you call 'priority'.

 

@k-9, see what you're saying - but outside was a crush also, so jumping the wall because you're being crushed would have made sense at the time.

 

I probably would have done it also if I feared I was going to be crushed. In the same clips I've seen of folk jumping the walls, many stood on top of the wall waving their hands about instructing people to move back rather than crush people who weren't through the turnstiles yet.

 

I would've simply climbed the fence if I found myself crushed, same as Millertime.

 

true

 

makes you wonder how you could be crushed in that situation though

 

if it was me, id use my rage to lift myself up using the fence!?

 

 

 

[tup]

When you're on steroids, the impossible becomes possible.

 

He might also have turned green, and ripped his own shirt clean off his back, thus scattering the crowd, and saving countless others from their fate of being crushed to death by each other.

[Karl Fletcher]

Karl Fletcher wasn't as good as Ryan Naysmith.

 

Monday Bandele > Karl Fletcher.

 

Luis Rodriguez > Karl Fletcher

 

Don Barker > Karl Fletcher.

 

 

www.youtube.com/watch?v=90M8jyAYag8

[RUL]

The footage from outside on news channels last night showed loads of fans getting "hifty" over the wall that day and it wasn't just one or two. Blame is one thing but contributory factor most certainly it would have been. Those over wall and those who went through exit gates not counted in the official statement which says the official no of fans in that end was under capacity.

 

Edit: personally if I had been part of those who jumped wall I would certainly find it hard to not be majorly guilty at the deaths.

 

Yeah but there's no evidence that these folk did not have tickets? There was a crush outside as well which is why folk were getting lifted over and indeed why the gates were eventually opened.

 

 

 

 

[Tommy]

Yeah but there's no evidence that these folk did not have tickets? There was a crush outside as well which is why folk were getting lifted over and indeed why the gates were eventually opened.

 

There will be no evidence that it was all ticketholders that climbed the walls to get in.

 

 

People can argue all day on this but it wont bring back the dead.

[steems]

Edit: personally if I had been part of those who jumped wall I would certainly find it hard to not be majorly guilty at the deaths.

 

So should any football fan, up and down the country, who has ever jumped the wall, gone through the turnstyle with a friend or bought a ticket that had already been used by another fan also feel some guilt?

[Foster14]

One of a number of places I have read threads on this and they are all the same.

 

It is a disgrace the lengths the police (and colluders) went to cover their own backs. The people who were ment to manage and ensure the safety of the fans failed miserably at doing so. Instead of carrying out a proper review of what went wrong that day to learn from it, they set upon trying to make sure they weren't found culpable (at least in part). That is the most important thing that was revealed yesterday.

 

Conversation beyone that, meh...

 

Plastic Scousers revelling in it a bit too much. People who don't directly know anyone that was affected by the day filled with faux grief and seeming to enjoy the findings too much for my liking.

 

Anti-Liverpool folks trolling a bit to get rises out of the plastics etc.

 

Tis one of those things where football fan tribalism should go out the window.

[K-9]

Yeah but there's no evidence that these folk did not have tickets? There was a crush outside as well which is why folk were getting lifted over and indeed why the gates were eventually opened.

Seriously? You really believe that? Surely not!!

[Foster14]

Rocket, lets get one thing straight - this is a forum. Do you grasp the difference between real life and ze internet? Just wondering like - or do you just back space, hash tag the fuck out of the real world as well because you cannot grasp the difference? I'm just asking like.

 

You not going to further expand on your 'speculating'? I did quiz you, tried to make it simple - but obviously with you being an angry keyboard warrior** (or perhaps it was because I called you 'not small' that you're holding against me...or perhaps because I've seen you before - I'm not quite sure what you think I made personal, unless you are an angry man in real life and you're taking that to heart?) and trying to make me engage in nonsense with you - you've missed the point I'm trying to get you to elaborate on...

 

'speculate' away...

 

I'm interested.

 

** - NOTE: the key words, keyboard warrior, as in on the internets, not real lifez. Yi dig?

 

P.S. 'were this going to lead to' since you said to me, that I apparently know 'were this leads'....

 

Is the turning on a computer meant to turn a person in to a twat? Where does this "internets" thing start and stop? If someone acts like a twat on facebook, can there defence be that it is the "internets?"

 

People that go on the internet and act all different to their "real life" persona are obviously missing something in their "real life."

[Foster14]

Facebook you are a real person, that's you. On here, you can be anyone - because no one knows you, see Scarface for example if you remember him.

 

That is just bizarre still. I do not understand why someone would deliberately act differently just because they are not known (which to be honest, you are).

[Ando]

This guy doesn't like The Sun and its collaborators very much

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HJgCqotmsWY

[Bluto10]

any date on when the hysel files will be in the pd?

[Foster14]

Ask Scarface...not me.

 

I'm known in what way? That's bizarre to me.

 

Plenty folk on here know you.

 

As I said, someone who comes on the internet and acts like a numpty but justifies it because it is the internet clearly has something missing from their lives. Unless they are actually a numpty.

 

I'm nae aiming this at you as such, just that you seem to be saying the "internets" is not real and that is incorrect. It is obviously satisfying a real empty part in your life or you'd nae be on here as much.

 

Then you will probably explain that you are at work and bored, but does your real self bore you sufficiently that you have to act differently on here?

[Foster14]

My life is far from empty. And I don't think Scarfaces life is empty either, he just had a bit of banter and pretended to be someone he wasn't,

 

He created a second version of himself and gave himself +1s.

 

There is something definitely nae quite right there!

 

but something missing - I don't go with that at all, but that's where we differ.

 

Is that the real you differing or "internets" you? I just don't know now!!!

[steems]

Are you saying that they sold an excessive number of tickets which caused people to be crushed to death?

 

If so, you provide the figures. I know that there were more in there than there should have been for a number of reasons, but one of them wasn't that they oversold ticket allocations for that pen.

 

They did sell an excessive amount of tickets - that was highlighted in the report - I believe they sold over 2,000 tickets for an area that should only have held 1,600.

The ground did not have safety certificate.

Add the fact that there was no control ensuring the crowd went to the correct pens.

 

I wonder why there were no police or stewards controlling the entrance to pens 3 and 4?

I wonder why, after the previous years semi had done this, there was no police stopping ticketless fans getting near the ground.

[Foster14]

He -1'd me all the time also, but I don't hold it against him. I bet he's a fun character in real life, who sniffs a lot of coke and shags strippers... . You know what I mean there, how things can't be taken too seriously when it's written on the net?

 

I'd expect that to be an extension of the kind of banter he has with other folks though. If he adopts a persona for the internet, then it is a bit weird (i.e. why do it? Unless you are missing something?)

 

As for taking everything seriously, nah, that isn't what this is about. It is about people who take a stance on something then when they get found out, say they weren't being serious because it was the internet. Things like that.

[rgudon]

I'd expect that to be an extension of the kind of banter he has with other folks though. If he adopts a persona for the internet, then it is a bit weird (i.e. why do it? Unless you are missing something?)

 

As for taking everything seriously, nah, that isn't what this is about. It is about people who take a stance on something then when they get found out, say they weren't being serious because it was the internet. Things like that.

 

Having met Roberto I can confirm he's a knob in real life as well as the internet......