Roswell 1947

[looksgoodinred]

How to estimate the number of civilisations in a galaxy:

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drake_equation

 

...and here is some additional info on Project Mogul, by far the likeliest explanation for what happened at Roswell in 1947. It was actually the Soviets they were spying on, nae sure where I picked up Japan from (bloody Discovery Channel, probably):

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_Mogul

 

i already said and posted that this morning. but noooo.. no one listened to me.

[bonzodaddy73]

Whoa whoa fucking WHOA! When did I say that?

 

There absolutely, positively is life elsewhere in the Universe. The odds on us being the only life-supporting planet in the universe are fucking ridiculous. And it stands to reason that many of these planets will support or will have supported at one time lifeforms vastly more intelligent than us. For a good way of estimating how many Earth-like planets there are in the universe at any one time read Carl Sagan's Cosmos.

 

I urge you to re-read my earlier post. All I did was attempt to debunk the Roswell nonsense and also defuse the ET/UFO hysteria, which does my fucking box in.

 

Is there life elsewhere in the universe? yes, of course.

 

Is there the slightest scrap of evidence to suggest that any of these lifeforms have ever been here? Not really, no.

I wasn't having a go at you earlier,sorry if it came across like that.

I personally reckon there has been visitations of sorts throughout history. Your either a believer or not I suppose.

[The Oxford Don]

i already said and posted that this morning. but noooo.. no one listened to me.

 

Bit of a 'Fail' on my part LGIR, completely missed that. In my defence I had only skimmed through the posts up until then and didn't think anyone else had mentioned the Mogul link before my own post on page 2. Apologies.

[looksgoodinred]

Bit of a 'Fail' on my part LGIR, completely missed that. In my defence I had only skimmed through the posts up until then and didn't think anyone else had mentioned the Mogul link before my own post on page 2. Apologies.

 

lol.. no apologies necessary :-)

just next time i'll hop up and down when i try to make a point.

[E-P-K]

Infinite possibilities.

[The Oxford Don]

I wasn't having a go at you earlier,sorry if it came across like that.

I personally reckon there has been visitations of sorts throughout history. Your either a believer or not I suppose.

 

Nae bother, just thought you'd maybe missed the point I was making, which wasn't really related to the likelihood of alien existence, just the chances of it having ever been here.

 

There is only one (that I am aware of) genuine, out-there, WTF-was-that UFO-type incident for which there is as yet no good explanation. Codenamed 'Fastwalker', in the mid-70s an unidentified object came yammering into the Earth's atmosphere at a great rate of knots, stopped dead about a mile above the Indian Ocean, hovered for a few seconds and then went charging back out into deep space. There were no eyewitnesses, but the object was tracked by a US spy satellite. Make of that one what you will.

[bonzodaddy73]

Nae bother, just thought you'd maybe missed the point I was making, which wasn't really related to the likelihood of alien existence, just the chances of it having ever been here.

 

There is only one (that I am aware of) genuine, out-there, WTF-was-that UFO-type incident for which there is as yet no good explanation. Codenamed 'Fastwalker', in the mid-70s an unidentified object came yammering into the Earth's atmosphere at a great rate of knots, stopped dead about a mile above the Indian Ocean, hovered for a few seconds and then went charging back out into deep space. There were no eyewitnesses, but the object was tracked by a US spy satellite. Make of that one what you will.

I have heard if that incident actually. Very very strange Indeed.

Are you aware if the Phoenix lights case,if so what's your take on that?

[Terrorfex]

What's your day job TF? You seem to know a lot about science?

 

Aircraft Engineering - currently back in education just now so probably have too much time on my hands.

[Bobby Connor]

Here's the poem Kelt posted a while back:

 

Seems relevant.

 

IN Egypt's sandy silence, all alone,

Stands a gigantic Leg, which far off throws

The only shadow that the Desert knows:

[The Oxford Don]

I have heard if that incident actually. Very very strange Indeed.

Are you aware if the Phoenix lights case,if so what's your take on that?

 

Yep, the 'Phoenix lights' case is a real beaut of the genre, not least because of the sheer number of eyewitnesses.

 

There's a really good documentary on it, called I think 'Lights over Phoenix'. In the programme, they superimpose the view from where the footage was shot in daytime over the night-time footage of the lights, and the lights correspond EXACTLY to the outline of a distant hill. So in other words, the lights appeared in the sky, hung in the sky for a while and then disappeared below the artifical horizon represented by the hill. Given that there was an extensive military exercise on the go at the time, and given also that the aircraft involved were banging out flares, I think that the best explanation is that the lights represented flares from the aircraft which then sank below the line of the hill.

[Ke1t]

I have heard if that incident actually. Very very strange Indeed.

Are you aware if the Phoenix lights case,if so what's your take on that?

 

May have been debunked.

 

There's a documentary somewhere around, probably on the Youtubes, that does a reasonable job of explaining that particular sighting.

 

Whereas I had been convinced to a certain extent as to the validity of the sighting and the subsequent footage, there's something that you can't see in the video that could be important as to the... I'm not going to say authenticity, because the footage is authentic... but as to it being the giant craft it appears to be.

 

I'm somewhere on the fence now regarding the Phoenix Lights.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wFWMc1RmepA&feature=fvst

 

I'm more swayed by the Jerusalem footage, which was apparently a fraud until footage from other witnesses appeared.

 

Independent verification seems to point towards it's authenticity.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lDsXl7hAv3Q

 

I've read on Conspiracy boards that this is part of Project Bluebeam... which, if you're into Conspiracy stuff, is at least plausible, I guess.

[bonzodaddy73]

Yep, the 'Phoenix lights' case is a real beaut of the genre, not least because of the sheer number of eyewitnesses.

 

There's a really good documentary on it, called I think 'Lights over Phoenix'. In the programme, they superimpose the view from where the footage was shot in daytime over the night-time footage of the lights, and the lights correspond EXACTLY to the outline of a distant hill. So in other words, the lights appeared in the sky, hung in the sky for a while and then disappeared below the artifical horizon represented by the hill. Given that there was an extensive military exercise on the go at the time, and given also that the aircraft involved were banging out flares, I think that the best explanation is that the lights represented flares from the aircraft which then sank below the line of the hill.

I think I seen that on discovery or something, but wasn't the flares theory debunked because of the way they are dispersed and the rate they lose altitude?

[Ke1t]

Here's the poem Kelt posted a while back:

 

Seems relevant.

 

 

 

He had to explain it to me but the overall message seems obvious now.

 

I think the poem posted would have been Ozymandias, by Shelley.

 

He was having a contest with another poet, Horace Smith, to see who could create the better poem re Ozymandias. And what you've posted there is Smith's effort.

 

Shelley's is;

 

I met a traveller from an antique land

Who said: Two vast and trunkless legs of stone

Stand in the desert. Near them, on the sand,

Half sunk, a shattered visage lies, whose frown,

And wrinkled lip, and sneer of cold command,

Tell that its sculptor well those passions read

Which yet survive, stamped on these lifeless things,

The hand that mocked them and the heart that fed:

And on the pedestal these words appear:

"My name is Ozymandias, king of kings:

Look on my works, ye Mighty, and despair!"

Nothing beside remains. Round the decay

Of that colossal wreck, boundless and bare

The lone and level sands stretch far away.

[Bobby Connor]

I find the building of pyramids and the shafts being lined up with the belt of Orion more fascinating than science fiction masel.

 

My dad could lecture for hours on how the circumference of the great pyramid is the exact representation of a light year and various other mathematical 'coincidences' related to the pyramids and stuff that the ancient Egyptians should have had no right to know about.

 

Until he gets down to actually writing his book it's hard to keep up with over the telephone so maybe he's just mad. He's smarter than me though, not that that makes him exceptionally bright per se.

 

He's spent at least 10 years studying it and my grandad before him also had a wee obsession with it all.

[The Oxford Don]

I find the building of pyramids and the shafts being lined up with the belt of Orion more fascinating than science fiction masel.

 

Fascinating as you say, and more or less widely accepted now isn't it?

 

Must have been an amazing feeling being the person to make the pyramid/Orion connection, what a quality 'Eureka!' moment that must have been.

[The Oxford Don]

I think the poem posted would have been Ozymandias, by Shelley.

 

He was having a contest with another poet, Horace Smith, to see who could create the better poem re Ozymandias. And what you've posted there is Smith's effort.

 

Shelley's is;

 

I met a traveller from an antique land

Who said: Two vast and trunkless legs of stone

Stand in the desert. Near them, on the sand,

Half sunk, a shattered visage lies, whose frown,

And wrinkled lip, and sneer of cold command,

Tell that its sculptor well those passions read

Which yet survive, stamped on these lifeless things,

The hand that mocked them and the heart that fed:

And on the pedestal these words appear:

"My name is Ozymandias, king of kings:

Look on my works, ye Mighty, and despair!"

Nothing beside remains. Round the decay

Of that colossal wreck, boundless and bare

The lone and level sands stretch far away.

 

I studied Shelley at uni. A complex and fascinating man. I really enjoyed his stuff, even if he did end up driving me half-demented.

[Ke1t]

Sorry, but this thread is screaming out for some Giorgio A. Tsoukalos.

 

[bonzodaddy73]

May have been debunked.

 

There's a documentary somewhere around, probably on the Youtubes, that does a reasonable job of explaining that particular sighting.

 

Whereas I had been convinced to a certain extent as to the validity of the sighting and the subsequent footage, there's something that you can't see in the video that could be important as to the... I'm not going to say authenticity, because the footage is authentic... but as to it being the giant craft it appears to be.

 

I'm somewhere on the fence now regarding the Phoenix Lights.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wFWMc1RmepA&feature=fvst

 

I'm more swayed by the Jerusalem footage, which was apparently a fraud until footage from other witnesses appeared.

 

Independent verification seems to point towards it's authenticity.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lDsXl7hAv3Q

 

I've read on Conspiracy boards that this is part of Project Bluebeam... which, if you're into Conspiracy stuff, is at least plausible, I guess.

I think you can safely say the Jerusalem footage ain't no flare that's for sure. As for the Phoenix one, I'm no expert but don't think flares could hold in the sky like that in perfect alignment.

[Ke1t]

I think you can safely say the Jerusalem footage ain't no flare that's for sure. As for the Phoenix one, I'm no expert but don't think flares could hold in the sky like that in perfect alignment.

 

No, the Jerusalem 'UFO' isn't a flare, unless flares now have the ability to descend slowly, hover, flash, then accelerate immediately to superfast speeds vertically upwards. Seems unlikely.

 

Theoretically you could possibly project that image, but then you would expect to see the 'track' of the projection.

 

As in;

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zsiSirIq4SA&feature=related

[NorthernLights24]

Fascinating as you say, and more or less widely accepted now isn't it?

 

Must have been an amazing feeling being the person to make the pyramid/Orion connection, what a quality 'Eureka!' moment that must have been.

 

The thoughts of a professional astrophysicist - http://podcast.sjrdesign.net/shownotes_034.php

[The Oxford Don]

The thoughts of a professional astrophysicist - http://podcast.sjrdesign.net/shownotes_034.php

 

Thanks for that, not really 'widely accepted' then!

 

Although, did they not find the foundations for other pyramids corresponding to the location of other stars in the Orion constellation? So basically, they set out to recreate Orion but ran out of big stones or got bored or something?

 

I'm sure I read about this somewhere, but if the guy is as much of a self-aggrandising cock as he is made out to be on that link you posted then he might actually have just made it up.

[Bobby Connor]

The Orion belt stuff is a load of balls. It's far fucking cleverer than that.

[Bobby Connor]

Consider every angle, dimension and relationship on the Giza plateau as a description of time and space. That's where the old boy is coming from with it and has been going on about for years.

 

Like I said earlier, he could be completely barmy. He's an exceptionally intelligent dude so it's one of those that could land either way. I tend to side with him but I'm biased and it's tough maths to get your head into.

[bonzodaddy73]

No, the Jerusalem 'UFO' isn't a flare, unless flares now have the ability to descend slowly, hover, flash, then accelerate immediately to superfast speeds vertically upwards. Seems unlikely.

 

Theoretically you could possibly project that image, but then you would expect to see the 'track' of the projection.

 

As in;

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zsiSirIq4SA&feature=related

There was a few of those spiral vids on the go for a while there, can't say I was ever impressed bu them.

On another note. I read a book about supposed alien craft (cannot remember for the life of me who wrote it) but the author was suggesting that the craft themselves were actual living things that could jump dimensions.

It was quite interesting but the more I think about it I think the guy just watched a lot of Farscape lol

[The Oxford Don]

Consider every angle, dimension and relationship on the Giza plateau as a description of time and space. That's where the old boy is coming from with it and has been going on about for years.

 

Like I said earlier, he could be completely barmy. He's an exceptionally intelligent dude so it's one of those that could land either way. I tend to side with him but I'm biased and it's tough maths to get your head into.

 

Blimey - like a sort of primitive version of Einstein's Theory of Relativity!?

 

I think I'd get on just fine with your old man, BC. Sounds like my kind of barmy.

[Bobby Connor]

Blimey - like a sort of primitive version of Einstein's Theory of Relativity!?

 

I think I'd get on just fine with your old man, BC. Sounds like my kind of barmy.

 

He's deadly serious and has spent hours trying to explain it into my smaller brain. It kinda makes sense, what he is saying and some of the exact numbers are mental.

 

You'd get on with my dad. Only his wife doesn't.

[The Oxford Don]

Crop circles were cool, a fad a few years back. This is where earth and scifi mixed. Some were convinced they were done by spacemen. Others thought is was a bunch of dudes having a larf. Neither theory for their sudden overnight appearances seemed plausible to me.

 

Where regular science demands explanations, I'm happy not knowing because until someone owns up, or someone actually nails where they came from, we ain't ever gonna know. That's cool. I thought the shapes were quite beautiful. Not going to waste my time investigating them though.

 

The KLF hoaxed a few crop circles, didn't they?

 

I fucking loved the KLF...

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aqxtBggVsi0

[Ke1t]

There was a few of those spiral vids on the go for a while there, can't say I was ever impressed bu them.

On another note. I read a book about supposed alien craft (cannot remember for the life of me who wrote it) but the author was suggesting that the craft themselves were actual living things that could jump dimensions.

It was quite interesting but the more I think about it I think the guy just watched a lot of Farscape lol

 

Yeah, there are as many theories regarding UFOs as there are lunatics on the planet, I think.

 

For my part, I know there are UFOs because I saw one myself.

 

Coming back from, I think it was Greece or Russia, I looked out of my window, behind me and down below the plane, and I saw (cliche) a cigar-shaped object drift down into the clouds on an angle. It could only have been in my line of sight for a few seconds, then it was gone.

 

No wings, no tail, no smoke to suggest it was a rocket or missile. Regular shaped, so not a meteorite. It was moving in a controlled fashion, not tumbling or freefalling.

 

What it was I'm fucked if I know, but not any regular aircraft that I've heard of or seen.

 

Not the most exciting sighting ever, but enough to assure me that there's shit up there that follows no conventional aircraft design that we know of. Who makes them, dunno. could be US Black Book projects... there's two and a half trillion unaccounted for dollars in the Pentagon's budget. Just gone... no-one knows where. you can build and fly a lot of secret shit for two and a half trillion dollars, though.

 

The flying triangles that people have been seeing lately, I'm edging towards those being American secret projects. The TR-3B... allegedly uses rapidly spun plasma to generate it's power. It's (allegedly) silent and acts as a form of anti-gravity. Lots of people seeing them. I remember the US denied they had stealth tech until they rolled it out onto the tarmac in front of the press... I think it'll be the same with the TR-3B.

[Bobby Connor]

The stuff my dad is investigating is not hippy shit, it's pure maths. Whether he is drawing the wrong conclusions is what I'm not 100% sure of. He has probably spent more time researching the fucking things and boring my ears off with it than any previous human.

[The Oxford Don]

The flying triangles that people have been seeing lately, I'm edging towards those being American secret projects. The TR-3B... allegedly uses rapidly spun plasma to generate it's power. It's (allegedly) silent and acts as a form of anti-gravity. Lots of people seeing them. I remember the US denied they had stealth tech until they rolled it out onto the tarmac in front of the press... I think it'll be the same with the TR-3B.

 

TR-3 or possibly the infamous 'Aurora' (could those be one and the same thing?) Highly suspicious that the Americans haven't ever replaced the SR-71... you just don't willingly surrender a capability like that without having something better to replace it. And I don't buy the argument that it was replaced by spy satellites, an aircraft has obvious advantages over a satellite in terms of its ability to be routed towards specific targets at short notice.

 

Just on the topic of stealth, I was at the recent International Air Tattoo at Fairford in Gloucestershire where the star of the show was a B-2 Spirit on static. First time in 12 years that there had been a stealth bomber on the ground at an airshow in the UK. I had seen them before but only on flypasts, and it is one weird looking dude when you get up close. When you see something like that you begin to understand where a lot of UFO sightings came from.