Proposed new stadium, by Aberdeen beach

[zeroisgod76]

20 minutes ago, fine-n-dandy said:

Ah the old 'space' issue 🤣 

PLENTY room on main stand rd/carpark side. Not hard to reroute a wee rd like that.

South could be done on same footprint (it's not going to be a main stand) we're not trying to build a fkn castle here

 

Why 'less corporate'? most of & the best corporate is already in the DD stand.

 

You are pedaling a BS story/agenda that was created

Below is the UEFA requirements, we'd maybe not be too far away on the Merkland and RDS ends but would need at least another 2 metres on the Main and South Stand sides. That already takes away a decent chunk of the current footprint.

We're not going to be rerouting Pittodrie Street, thats just a completely dumb suggestion. So straight away Main and South become far smaller than the current stands. Can likely forget about putting any boxes / corporate into the new main stand as there won't be room. So thats less income coming in every year.

Maybe the most & the best corporate is currently in the RDS, but in a new stadium we;d have far more and far better corporate facilities that would bring in far more money every year.

 

[fine-n-dandy]

7 minutes ago, zeroisgod76 said:

Below is the UEFA requirements, we'd maybe not be too far away on the Merkland and RDS ends but would need at least another 2 metres on the Main and South Stand sides. That already takes away a decent chunk of the current footprint.

We're not going to be rerouting Pittodrie Street, thats just a completely dumb suggestion. So straight away Main and South become far smaller than the current stands. Can likely forget about putting any boxes / corporate into the new main stand as there won't be room. So thats less income coming in every year.

Maybe the most & the best corporate is currently in the RDS, but in a new stadium we;d have far more and far better corporate facilities that would bring in far more money every year.

 

Just how exactly is rerouting (or even closing) Pittodrie st a dumb suggestion? Please back that up. Why is that not an option? Is it somehow A Listed? 🤣 more than enough room for a great main stand that side. South doesn’t have to be a big fancy stand. We don’t need 4 identical style matchy matchy DD stands. Which is what all the new purpose built stadium wishers are having a wankfest wanting

 

again. A BS agenda being backed up by plenty with ZERO substance & they ridicule those pushing for Pittodrie redevelopment for exactly the same thing

[zeroisgod76]

9 minutes ago, fine-n-dandy said:

Just how exactly is rerouting (or even closing) Pittodrie st a dumb suggestion? Please back that up. Why is that not an option? Is it somehow A Listed? 🤣 more than enough room for a great main stand that side. South doesn’t have to be a big fancy stand. We don’t need 4 identical style matchy matchy DD stands. Which is what all the new purpose built stadium wishers are having a wankfest wanting

 

again. A BS agenda being backed up by plenty with ZERO substance & they ridicule those pushing for Pittodrie redevelopment for exactly the same thing

You know people live on Pittodrie Street, its not just the football club thats there. You can't just close the road and even if you rerouted it through the car park (which is a fucking stupid idea) you're again cutting into space that can be used for a new stand.

I'm not personally bothered about having 4 identical stands... what would be pathetic for a club like ours would be having one stand (RDS) holding 6000 and the other 3 stands holding 6000 between them (which would be the likely outcome of staying at Pittodrie) which would be tinpot as fuck.

 

[fine-n-dandy]

5 minutes ago, zeroisgod76 said:

You know people live on Pittodrie Street, its not just the football club thats there. You can't just close the road and even if you rerouted it through the car park (which is a fucking stupid idea) you're again cutting into space that can be used for a new stand.

I'm not personally bothered about having 4 identical stands... what would be pathetic for a club like ours would be having one stand (RDS) holding 6000 and the other 3 stands holding 6000 between them (which would be the likely outcome of staying at Pittodrie) which would be tinpot as fuck.

 

So at worst they need to buy a couple of houses 🤣

 

BS excuses to justify a stance with no substance in reality. 
 

House owners would still have access even if Pittodrie st was done away with completely along length of stand. 
 

FFS it’s all talk like they’re trying to build a mega structure like the Panama Canal or something 🤣

 

why don’t you make up even more exaggerated numbers even lower for the remaining new capacity of THREE new stands for even more dramatic effect? 🤣 especially when am only talking one big main & a new south & leave merky as is or just a lick o paint

[zeroisgod76]

1 minute ago, fine-n-dandy said:

So at worst they need to buy a couple of houses 🤣

Hahaha yeah its that simple right?

Keep living in your dreamland, thankfully its just a minority of numpties that think we'll still be staying at Pittodrie.

[fine-n-dandy]

3 minutes ago, zeroisgod76 said:

Hahaha yeah its that simple right?

Keep living in your dreamland, thankfully its just a minority of numpties that think we'll still be staying at Pittodrie.

Nobody said it was simple but you are talking like it’s like solving the meaning of life or how a woman’s brain works.

 

 

NOTHING you say has any factual substance to back up your conversations on main stand especially on Pittodrie st

 

 

& for the record. I don’t think we will be staying there. Far too many numpties have taken in the BS hook line sinker. I just 100% do not believe the pish the likes of you have bought into & are happy to try to convince all us numpties is FACT 🤣 

[thurso]

Just now, fine-n-dandy said:

Nobody said it was simple but you are talking like it’s like solving the meaning of life or how a woman’s brain works.

 

 

NOTHING you say has any factual substance to back up your conversations on main stand especially on Pittodrie st

Are you planning forcing people out of their houses just for a football stadium. 
 

There are also many reasons why a new build costs less than a renovation. 

[Ernie McCracken]

The council have done Cormack up like a kipper. More fool him for jumping in with them with both feet. 

Pittodrie is not an option

Kingsford is no longer an option as Dave went all in on the beach to such an extent that a significant portion of the fans who would have accepted Kingsford, now won't. 

And now the beach is looking like it's slipping away. 

There’s been a lot of posts on this thread about the merits of the various non options, but we'd all be as well sitting back and waiting for the next great masterplan, to be fucked about with for 3 or 4 years before getting ruled out. 

[sigh]

2 hours ago, Andy_123 said:

You don't pay VAT on new builds. So instantly you need to factor in 20% extra onto the cost of renovating Pittodrie.

I think it would be nearer the £10m of the £10-15m estimate the club had put on it before, but you can't say that's not that much.

You do pay VAT on new build sports stadia - it is only new build housing that is zero VAT rated.

Only difference between staying at Pittodrie or moving to new location are:

• No income from sale of Pittodire and land - although offset against cost of land at new location if moaving
• Less area to build if staying so future income would be reduced if we stay put - be that from ticket sales / food + drink sales / parking / hire out of stadia for gigs etc 
• If staying at Pittodrie though no need to bring in costly services / utilities as already there
• Loss of income during development of Pittodrie / cost to hire somewhere else during redevelopment

St Johnstone moved successfully, as did Inverness, St Mirren maybe and Falkirk didn't do well out of their move, most others have redeveloped

[NEM]

3 minutes ago, Ernie McCracken said:

The council have done Cormack up like a kipper. More fool him for jumping in with them with both feet. 

Pittodrie is not an option

Kingsford is no longer and option as Dave went all in on the beach to such an extent that a significant portion of the fans who would have accepted Kingsford, now won't. 

And now the beach is looking like its slipping away. 

There’s been a lot of posts on this thread about the merits of the various non options, but we'd all be as well sitting back and waiting for the next great masterplan, to be fucked about with for 3 or 4 years before getting ruled out. 

Second bold statement cancelling out the first...... 😄

[NEM]

3 minutes ago, sigh said:

You do pay VAT on new build sports stadia - it is only new build housing that is zero VAT rated.

Only difference between staying at Pittodrie or moving to new location are:

• No income from sale of Pittodire and land - although offset against cost of land at new location if moaving
• Less area to build if staying so future income would be reduced if we stay put - be that from ticket sales / food + drink sales / parking / hire out of stadia for gigs etc 
• If staying at Pittodrie though no need to bring in costly services / utilities as already there
• Loss of income during development of Pittodrie / cost to hire somewhere else during redevelopment

St Johnstone moved successfully, as did Inverness, St Mirren maybe and Falkirk didn't do well out of their move, most others have redeveloped

They had far bigger crowds at Muirton did they not?  No surprise given McDairmid is a terrible location.

[ERNIE]

Don't think we have £80 million for a new stadium.It was only going to work with help from the council.However you look at it the whole thing has been a muck up for around thirty years now.And can those who say moving is only option why was rds stand built and what was the plan then?

[Ten Caat]

4 minutes ago, sigh said:

You do pay VAT on new build sports stadia - it is only new build housing that is zero VAT rated.

Only difference between staying at Pittodrie or moving to new location are:

• No income from sale of Pittodire and land - although offset against cost of land at new location if moaving
• Less area to build if staying so future income would be reduced if we stay put - be that from ticket sales / food + drink sales / parking / hire out of stadia for gigs etc 
• If staying at Pittodrie though no need to bring in costly services / utilities as already there
• Loss of income during development of Pittodrie / cost to hire somewhere else during redevelopment

St Johnstone moved successfully, as did Inverness, St Mirren maybe and Falkirk didn't do well out of their move, most others have redeveloped

Inverness was 2 clubs amalgamating. New stadium probably the best all round, to meet regulations and be a neutral ground so that one or the other of the historic clubs wasn't seen as being favoured. Bu around a mile from both of the grounds vacated.

St Johnstone moved about a mile as the crow flies (although by road it's about 2 miles). St Mirren's move is better worked out in yards rather than miles....about 1000 yards. Falkirk's move from the town centre to the edge of town about a mile and a half.

If we go to Kingswells it's a 6 mile move, so a fair bit further than the 4 clubs you mentioned moved. Would that affect our crowds detrimentally? I'd envisage that a fair number of our support will find themselves a lot closer to a new stadium there than they currently do to Pittodrie.

If there was a way to stay at a revamped Pittodrie that was affordable, met all current legislation and kept our capacity at 17k minimum I'd favour that. I'm just not sure that there is

[sooth_stander]

21 minutes ago, sigh said:

You do pay VAT on new build sports stadia - it is only new build housing that is zero VAT rated.

Only difference between staying at Pittodrie or moving to new location are:

• No income from sale of Pittodire and land - although offset against cost of land at new location if moaving
• Less area to build if staying so future income would be reduced if we stay put - be that from ticket sales / food + drink sales / parking / hire out of stadia for gigs etc 
• If staying at Pittodrie though no need to bring in costly services / utilities as already there
• Loss of income during development of Pittodrie / cost to hire somewhere else during redevelopment

St Johnstone moved successfully, as did Inverness, St Mirren maybe and Falkirk didn't do well out of their move, most others have redeveloped

Stuart Cosgrove mentioned at the weekend that St Johnstone are looking to move to a new, smaller,  7000 seater stadium, as the maintenance costs on their current 10k stadium are counter productive.

Couldn’t believe it when he said that. On a 30 yr old stadium?

Fuck only knows what we are paying annually to maintain Pittodrie. 

[Gooby1983]

2 hours ago, zeroisgod76 said:

Below is the UEFA requirements, we'd maybe not be too far away on the Merkland and RDS ends but would need at least another 2 metres on the Main and South Stand sides. That already takes away a decent chunk of the current footprint.

We're not going to be rerouting Pittodrie Street, thats just a completely dumb suggestion. So straight away Main and South become far smaller than the current stands. Can likely forget about putting any boxes / corporate into the new main stand as there won't be room. So thats less income coming in every year.

Maybe the most & the best corporate is currently in the RDS, but in a new stadium we;d have far more and far better corporate facilities that would bring in far more money every year.

 

Why could we not reroute or close Pittodrie Street completely? The council was going to close the Beach Esplanade and accommodation road permanintaly for the plans at the beach, so why would closing Pittodrie Street to allow a new main stand to be built be such an issue when bigger uproar and traffic upheaval was planned for nearby? The council should be urged to compromise, since they have shafted us over the years! Plenty parallel streets nearby that can be used for access if you closed Pittodrie Street for good . A large main stand would also allow for a smaller south and those 4 metres required, all then that would really need to be done with the South and Merkland would be re concrete the terraces, add safe standing a new roof and matching cladding, the rds could also be re cladded to finish it off. This must be a feasible option? 

[Ten Caat]

24 minutes ago, NEM said:

They had far bigger crowds at Muirton did they not?  No surprise given McDairmid is a terrible location.

I've just looked at season 83/84 where St J were newly promoted into the PL Their biggest crowd at Muirton was just shy of 10k against oldco. They actually once pulled in a bigger crowd v the DABS at around 7k than they did against Celtic (by a few hundred).  Games against the likes of St Mirren, Motherwell and (surprisingly) Dundee and it drops to about 2.5k. 

So really no worse or no better than what they're getting now

[Ten Caat]

15 minutes ago, Gooby1983 said:

Why could we not reroute or close Pittodrie Street completely? The council was going to close the Beach Esplanade and accommodation road permanintaly for the plans at the beach, so why would closing Pittodrie Street to allow a new main stand to be built be such an issue when bigger uproar and traffic upheaval was planned for nearby? The council should compremise since they have shafted us over the years! Plenty parallel streets nearby that can be used for access if you closed Pittodrie Street for good . A large main stand would also allow for a smaller south and those 4 metres required, all then that would really need to be done with the South and Merkland would be re concrete the terraces, add safe standing a new roof and matching cladding, the rds could also be re cladded to finish it off. This must be a feasible option? 

There are supposedly a shitload of services buried under Pittodrie St. These would also need re-routing, a far bigger job than simply re-routing a road by itself. You think the council would do all that for free? 

[Andy_123]

38 minutes ago, Ernie McCracken said:

The council have done Cormack up like a kipper. More fool him for jumping in with them with both feet. 

Pittodrie is not an option

Kingsford is no longer an option as Dave went all in on the beach to such an extent that a significant portion of the fans who would have accepted Kingsford, now won't. 

And now the beach is looking like it's slipping away. 

There’s been a lot of posts on this thread about the merits of the various non options, but we'd all be as well sitting back and waiting for the next great masterplan, to be fucked about with for 3 or 4 years before getting ruled out. 

Aye he's been hung out to dry. It was entirely predictable as well. I said as soon as ACC announced they wanted AFC to stay at the beach that this was how it was going to end up. Imagine trusting an organisation who were wanting you to be part of a plan to install a zip line from broadhill and have shark tanks and whatever other nonsense it was they were on about. 

Feel a bit for Cormack on this occasion actually because whether you agreed with his plan or not, he at least had one for Kingsford that had been given the green light and was ready to get moving as soon as we had the money in place, which is more than can be said for any of the previous attempts we've made. Had it not been for COVID, I reckon we'd have broken ground out there by now.

But as you say now that the beach has been dangled as a possibility in front of the fans by ACC, too many won't accept Kingsford. They knew fine well what they were doing. 

[fine-n-dandy]

So much BS being spoken (for both options) when both are easily possible but both will cost a fortune regardless. 
 

I’m going to bed but will no doubt return to counter the copious amounts of BS with copious amounts of BS of my own some other time

 

 

Unless of course Barron signs a new deal 😉🤣

[Andy_123]

29 minutes ago, Gooby1983 said:

Why could we not reroute or close Pittodrie Street completely? The council was going to close the Beach Esplanade and accommodation road permanintaly for the plans at the beach, so why would closing Pittodrie Street to allow a new main stand to be built be such an issue when bigger uproar and traffic upheaval was planned for nearby? The council should be urged to compromise, since they have shafted us over the years! Plenty parallel streets nearby that can be used for access if you closed Pittodrie Street for good . A large main stand would also allow for a smaller south and those 4 metres required, all then that would really need to be done with the South and Merkland would be re concrete the terraces, add safe standing a new roof and matching cladding, the rds could also be re cladded to finish it off. This must be a feasible option? 

Nobody lives on the esplanade. Would you be happy if the council rocked up and said we're closing the street you live on for 2-3 years?

Re-routing a road isn't as simple as just flattening some ground and pouring tar. You've got services, sewers, drainage etc under the road all needing diverted as well.

[NEM]

The council have said they won't contribute to the cost but we can build at the beach if we like so what major difference is there between that and building at Kingsford? 

They're not going to contribute to the Westhill white elephant either so it's either beach if we can afford a new stadium, stay put if we can't 😎

 

[zeroisgod76]

1 hour ago, Ernie McCracken said:

The council have done Cormack up like a kipper. More fool him for jumping in with them with both feet. 

Pittodrie is not an option

Kingsford is no longer an option as Dave went all in on the beach to such an extent that a significant portion of the fans who would have accepted Kingsford, now won't. 

And now the beach is looking like it's slipping away. 

There’s been a lot of posts on this thread about the merits of the various non options, but we'd all be as well sitting back and waiting for the next great masterplan, to be fucked about with for 3 or 4 years before getting ruled out. 

Cormack only has himself to blame. Anyone with half a brain would have known not to trust the council on this, they have history of fucking us about.

As for Kingsford. its likely to be the only option we have so those that don't like it will either have to get over it or find someone else to support.

[zeroisgod76]

19 minutes ago, NEM said:

The council have said they won't contribute to the cost but we can build at the beach if we like so what major difference is there between that and building at Kingsford? 

They're not going to contribute to the Westhill white elephant either so it's either beach if we can afford a new stadium, stay put if we can't 😎

 

Pretty certain the groundworks for a 100'000 tonne football stadium 50 metres from the North Sea will be significantly more expensive than most other places.

[Andy_123]

1 hour ago, sigh said:

You do pay VAT on new build sports stadia - it is only new build housing that is zero VAT rated.

Only difference between staying at Pittodrie or moving to new location are:

• No income from sale of Pittodire and land - although offset against cost of land at new location if moaving
• Less area to build if staying so future income would be reduced if we stay put - be that from ticket sales / food + drink sales / parking / hire out of stadia for gigs etc 
• If staying at Pittodrie though no need to bring in costly services / utilities as already there
• Loss of income during development of Pittodrie / cost to hire somewhere else during redevelopment

St Johnstone moved successfully, as did Inverness, St Mirren maybe and Falkirk didn't do well out of their move, most others have redeveloped

It's definitely not just new build housing that qualifies, there are others. Was assuming a sports stadium would be one of them but have never been involved in building one of those.

[Poodler]

10 minutes ago, zeroisgod76 said:

Pretty certain the groundworks for a 100'000 tonne football stadium 50 metres from the North Sea will be significantly more expensive than most other places.

How heavy are the seaton multies? 
 

must be on par with your wife 

[zeroisgod76]

8 minutes ago, Poodler said:

How heavy are the seaton multies? 
 

must be on par with your wife 

Are the Seaton multies 50 metres from the North Sea, literally the other side of the Esplanade from the sea? No? So zip it Poodles.

[NEM]

38 minutes ago, zeroisgod76 said:

Are the Seaton multies 50 metres from the North Sea, literally the other side of the Esplanade from the sea? No? So zip it Poodles.

The leisure centre float on thin air does it?

Another couple of million on groundworks to stay in the centre of Aberdeen is a no brainer*

 

*AKA a zeroisgod76

[zeroisgod76]

Just now, NEM said:

The leisure centre float on thin air does it?

Firstly the leisure centre isn't as big as any potential stadium, and secondly it'll be getting demolished soon so lasted what... 30 years?

[NEM]

4 minutes ago, zeroisgod76 said:

Firstly the leisure centre isn't as big as any potential stadium, and secondly it'll be getting demolished soon so lasted what... 30 years?

The fucks that got to do with anything? 😂

It's potentially being demolished soon cause it's shit, nothing to do with the groundworks.

[sooth_stander]

I don’t think much will be getting said by Cormack tonight at the AGM regarding the Beach stadium, as the Cooncil committee meeting isn’t until later in the week. 

He won’t want to say anything until the official announcement has been made by Cllr Swick and Co.